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Wlgold
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   Posted 12/24/2016 12:21 PM (GMT -5)    Quote This PostAlert An Admin About This Post.
I hardly ever use lyrics so this may be a dumb question. When I start a measure with a lyric and an expression, the two invariably collide. In older versions of Finale I think there was a setting under Document Options that prevented this, but I don't see it in Finale 25.2. Is there some way to go back after the fact and un-collide everything without adjusting each one manually? The vertical collision plugin doesn't seem to help.


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Zuill
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   Posted 12/24/2016 12:24 PM (GMT -5)    Quote This PostAlert An Admin About This Post.
I've not known of such a setting. There is a setting to keep syllables from colliding with each other, but not for collisions colliding with expressions.

Zuill


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ebiggs1
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   Posted 12/24/2016 12:33 PM (GMT -5)    Quote This PostAlert An Admin About This Post.
I don't do lyrics either until I was asked to put a piece in to Finale for publishing. I saw the same problem and was told by the publisher it was OK to put hairpins and dynamics on top of the staff.


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Zuill
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   Posted 12/24/2016 12:35 PM (GMT -5)    Quote This PostAlert An Admin About This Post.
Not only okay, but standard for vocal music.

Zuill


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Dr. Wiggy
Early music: modern methods



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   Posted 12/24/2016 2:16 PM (GMT -5)    Quote This PostAlert An Admin About This Post.
Zuill said...
Not only okay, but standard for vocal music.


Quite. In a vocal score, pretty much everything apart from the lyrics goes above the stave. This can even include articulations and triplet brackets/numbers on upward stems.


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Mike Rosen
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   Posted 12/24/2016 3:00 PM (GMT -5)    Quote This PostAlert An Admin About This Post.
So what do you do if you have multiple lines, like SATB, each with their own lyrics? I have seen some published score where they put them over every staff, with the resultant crowding and collisions. Is it acceptable to put them only above the top staff?



Mike Rosen
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Dr. Wiggy
Early music: modern methods



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   Posted 12/24/2016 4:33 PM (GMT -5)    Quote This PostAlert An Admin About This Post.
Generally, you need to leave enough space between staves for lyrics of the staff above and the expressions of the staff below. It's just that because you don't want stuff between the notes and the lyrics, you might as well put it on the top, rather than below the lyrics.


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Mike Rosen
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   Posted 12/24/2016 5:11 PM (GMT -5)    Quote This PostAlert An Admin About This Post.
That's what I thought. But it can really limit what fits on a page.



Mike Rosen
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Volunteer copyist (The Gang of Twelve) for the Barbershop Harmony Society
FINALE TIPS at www.specialmillwork.com/finale-tips-and-tricks/index.html

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Derrek
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   Posted 12/24/2016 6:47 PM (GMT -5)    Quote This PostAlert An Admin About This Post.
That's why choral music frequently uses a smaller staff size.


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ttw
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   Posted 12/24/2016 6:50 PM (GMT -5)    Quote This PostAlert An Admin About This Post.
Mike Rosen said...
So what do you do if you have multiple lines, like SATB, each with their own lyrics? I have seen some published score where they put them over every staff, with the resultant crowding and collisions. Is it acceptable to put them only above the top staff?

I suppose the traditional solution would be to publish part books rather than a score.


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Mike Rosen
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   Posted 12/24/2016 7:01 PM (GMT -5)    Quote This PostAlert An Admin About This Post.
That works with instruments. You put your fingers there, and the right sound (usually) comes out. I think singers (speaking as one, myself) like knowing what the other parts are doing, and picking up the occasional pitch from them.

I don't think I've ever seen a vocal part score.



Mike Rosen
www.specialmillwork.com

Bass with Choir of the Sound www.choirofthesound.org
Volunteer copyist (The Gang of Twelve) for the Barbershop Harmony Society
FINALE TIPS at www.specialmillwork.com/finale-tips-and-tricks/index.html

Finale 2014.5 on El Capitan
Simple Entry, QWERTY keyboard, numberpad. That's my system, and I'm stickin' to it.

"As a musician, he's a damn fine woodworker."

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Derrek
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   Posted 12/25/2016 9:24 AM (GMT -5)    Quote This PostAlert An Admin About This Post.
Well, they used to exist. Have you ever seen (images of) those oversized velum books where each part was oriented in a different direction for singers that gathered around the one hand-copied book to see their part? The Middle Ages/Renaissance was a different world.


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Dr. Wiggy
Early music: modern methods



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   Posted 12/25/2016 2:42 PM (GMT -5)    Quote This PostAlert An Admin About This Post.
The sort of music that used to appear in part-books (or choir-books or table-books) didn't really have much call for dynamics and other expressions!

I always hated the Durand & Cie Vocal Scores, which had multi-measure rests and no organ part, save for a few cue notes.

Here's a 1660 printed part.


Finale v.25.1, 2012 MacMini; 2012 MacBook Pro (10.11.6 / 10.12.1)
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Derrek
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   Posted 12/25/2016 4:29 PM (GMT -5)    Quote This PostAlert An Admin About This Post.
I suppose after trying to figure out how to fit syllables to the notes, dynamics and expressions would be the least of their medieval worries. :-)


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