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Michel R. E.
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   Posted 8/5/2016 3:24 PM (GMT -6)    Quote This PostAlert An Admin About This Post.
I am curious how most people would deal with this type of chromaticism.
I never know whether I should include the courtesy accidentals or not.

The 1st measure shows the notes without courtesy accidentals, the 2nd with them.
I would like to avoid clutter, but I would also like to avoid wrong notes being played!


EDIT: and oopsy, an extra natural sipped in there on a note that didn't require it.


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Post Edited (Michel R. E.) : 8/5/2016 3:29:49 PM (GMT-5)


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Flint
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   Posted 8/5/2016 3:42 PM (GMT -6)    Quote This PostAlert An Admin About This Post.
If it's for piano, leave the courtesies in, if it's a split wind/string part, I think you're fine leaving them out.


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Motet
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   Posted 8/5/2016 3:49 PM (GMT -6)    Quote This PostAlert An Admin About This Post.
I would include them in either case. If it's two parts on one staff you could leave them out in the parts, but even then it's a good safeguard against someone being confused by what the person next to them is playing. In the score I think it's essential so that no one thinks it's a mistake. Better to be clear than neat.


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Michel R. E.
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   Posted 8/5/2016 3:52 PM (GMT -6)    Quote This PostAlert An Admin About This Post.
it's actually for a solo violin part.
so I guess I get to keep the courtesy accidentals... fewer questions asked during rehearsals that way.


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Mike Rosen
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   Posted 8/5/2016 6:04 PM (GMT -6)    Quote This PostAlert An Admin About This Post.
Also, an accidental should he repeated on an octave note, if you want it. You have a C# on the third space, and then an octave above two notes later. Should that be a C# or a natural? Later in the measure, you have it marked as a natural.

Confusing, to my untrained eye.



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Motet
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   Posted 8/5/2016 6:54 PM (GMT -6)    Quote This PostAlert An Admin About This Post.
Though I generally don't like parentheses, here's a case where they might help.

Or, maybe just put accidentals on all Cs and Fs. (Or use Db and Gb?)


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Michel R. E.
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   Posted 8/5/2016 7:52 PM (GMT -6)    Quote This PostAlert An Admin About This Post.
Mike Rosen said...
Also, an accidental should he repeated on an octave note, if you want it. You have a C# on the third space, and then an octave above two notes later. Should that be a C# or a natural? Later in the measure, you have it marked as a natural.

Confusing, to my untrained eye.


1) those are two different examples (each measure represents a different way of notating it).
2) not meant for an untrained eye
3) my initial question was to see whether the extra accidentals, while not strictly necessary, would clutter the score.

this isn't "C major" tonal music, so not always easy for the musicians to guess what the notes should be.


**********

Regarding the example in question, I COULD use enharmonics to avoid entirely having to deal with same notes with different accidentals: make the C# into Db, or vice versa make the upper C naturals into B#... except I REALLY don't like seeing augmented 2nds or diminished 3rds in string writing.


Finale (started with ver. 3.0) using 2012 and now 2014 under Windows 8.1
basically ALL Garritan libraries, plus XSample Chamber Ensemble.

"Art critics suffer from Pigeon Syndrome. Pigeons like to leave their mark on monuments. But at the end of the day, the pigeon remains a pigeon, and the monument remains a monument."

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Claus
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   Posted 8/6/2016 7:26 AM (GMT -6)    Quote This PostAlert An Admin About This Post.
I would recommend to leave them in, just because of the vast number of situations (even with "pro" players) I found myself arguing about the rule, that (to my knowledge) says, that accidentals outside the key-signature are not only "just for that bar" but also "just for that octave".

Since at the end of one of those time consuming discussions a clarinet player being happy and proud presenting me a bunch full of publications (especially old LeDuc /France), where that rule obviously wasn't followed-

(i.e. a lot of arpeggio situations where a second note in the same bare appearing an octave higher without another accidental),

I tried to figure out, whether this "rule" is more or less a "habit" or a "house style" but unfortunately to no avail.

So now when preparing music somebody else I don't know has to (sight-)read, I rather go for an extra accidental instead of another go in the "who remembers his theory best?"-quiz show.
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Zoots
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   Posted 8/6/2016 8:43 AM (GMT -6)    Quote This PostAlert An Admin About This Post.
When in doubt, write to inform not to impress.


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OCTO.
The radical answers.



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   Posted 8/6/2016 4:43 PM (GMT -6)    Quote This PostAlert An Admin About This Post.
That phrases reminds me Bartok, at least Concerto 2 and Solosonata, which I performed. I don't have it here, but check that scores, would be interesting to see that solution.
I would use normal or in (). But always for solo violin.

EDIT: Yes, Bartok uses regular accidentals. I checked.


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Post Edited (OCTO.) : 8/6/2016 4:48:00 PM (GMT-5)

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