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Vaughan
Registered Member

Date Joined Jun 1999
Total Posts : 4984

Posted 11/24/2016 10:20 AM (GMT -6)

Unfortunately I'm not sure exactly when this started. Everything I print from Finale 25 is low resolution, or econo-mode, or as though the score is in colour and there's a grayscale conversion being applied, all despite the in-printer and Finale print settings. The same files printed via Finale 2014.5 print properly. Even more strange: the PDFs produced by Finale 25 also print low resolution (from Preview) whereas those produced by Finale 2014.5 print normally. This may or may not be relevant but I just produced test PDFs from the same page in both versions of Finale; the one made by 2014.5 is 106.7 KB and the one made by 25 is 93.5 KB. I've compared both PDFs on the screen at the highest magnification and I can't see a difference. The print settings in both versions are identical. I've printed from a number of applications and Finale 25 is the only program which has this problem. I'm at a total loss. Does anyone have an idea what might be going on?

Vaughan

Finale 3.2 - 25, Sibelius 4 - 7
Patterson's plugins, Tobias' plugins, full version, waiting for Jari's plugin update
MacOS 10.12
MacPro (2016) 16 GB, MacBookPro (2011) 8 GB

Amsterdam

Vaughan
Registered Member

Date Joined Jun 1999
Total Posts : 4984

Posted 11/24/2016 10:25 AM (GMT -6)

P.S. Restarting didn't help.

Vaughan

Finale 3.2 - 25, Sibelius 4 - 7
Patterson's plugins, Tobias' plugins, full version, waiting for Jari's plugin update
MacOS 10.12
MacPro (2016) 16 GB, MacBookPro (2011) 8 GB

Amsterdam

N. Grossingink
Registered Member

Date Joined Nov 2002
Total Posts : 3991

Posted 11/24/2016 10:45 AM (GMT -6)

What happens if you save as Postscript, open the PS in Preview (as PDF presumably) and then print?

N.

OSX El Capitan 10.11.6
Finale 2011c, 2012c for production work

Finale 2014.5, not used by my clients

(Finale v25 - not interested yet)

TgTools, Patterson Plugins, JW Change and Staff Polyphony, QuicKeys 4
Mac Mini 2.4 Ghz Intel, 8GB RAM
New Belgium Fat Tire Ale

"At last, fortissimo!"
–Gustav Mahler, on visiting Niagara Falls

Vaughan
Registered Member

Date Joined Jun 1999
Total Posts : 4984

Posted 11/24/2016 10:53 AM (GMT -6)

Just as bad, unfortunately, even though the .ps file is 463 KB, or more than 4 times as large as the PDF.

Vaughan

Finale 3.2 - 25, Sibelius 4 - 7
Patterson's plugins, Tobias' plugins, full version, waiting for Jari's plugin update
MacOS 10.12
MacPro (2016) 16 GB, MacBookPro (2011) 8 GB

Amsterdam

Zuill
"The Troll"

Date Joined Oct 2003
Total Posts : 29077

Posted 11/24/2016 11:06 AM (GMT -6)

It seems to me that I read that 25.1 has true black printing. You don't show that you have 25.1, but I would have guessed you do.

Zuill

"When all is said and done, more is said than done."

Win 7 64bit, 2011b, 2012c, 2014d, 2014.5

Favorite Forum quote: "Please, everybody, IGNORE THE TROLL!"

Dr. Wiggy
Early music: modern methods

Date Joined Jun 2006
Total Posts : 12628

Posted 11/24/2016 11:38 AM (GMT -6)

Yes, my first guess is that your printer driver is disassembling the black into colour parts. What is your printer?

Also, make sure you have ColorSync turned off. I had a problem where solid black lines would print with screening when ColorSync was turned on.

Can you send us a PDF to look at? Preflighting it in Acrobat might yield some answers.

Finale v.25.1, 2012 MacMini; 2012 MacBook Pro (10.11.6 / 10.12.1)
Edirol FA-66; Roland A-49, HP Laserjet 5200 DTN
Ancient Groove Music www.ancientgroove.co.uk

MikeHalloran
Registered Member

Date Joined Oct 2001
Total Posts : 217

Posted 11/24/2016 12:08 PM (GMT -6)

Since printing is different in 25, how are you doing it?

Finale 25.1, 2014.5, 2011c, SmartScore X Pro II, Encore 5.07, GPO 5
2010 iMac i7, 32G RAM, 2T SSD, Late 2013 MacBook Air, OS 10.12.1
MOTU Digital Performer 9.12, 9.02, Logic Pro X 10.2.4

jim dukey
Registered Member

Date Joined Apr 2004
Total Posts : 1082

Posted 11/24/2016 12:25 PM (GMT -6)

The Printing I've done w/Fin 25.1 seems better than before to me.
And the 2nd page on an 11/17 part is correctly centered.
Was always a little off center in previous versions.
Even hair-pins don't have the jagged edge I got before.
Very sharp resolution now.
But I may be hallucinating, I don't know...

Molecular Computer, Powered by Fusion in a Jar. Finale 3000, Wireless ESP Module, No Physical Interface, Printed Parts Manifest by The Universe,
SOOOO Boring! Now Everybody is Friggin' Mozart.

Vaughan
Registered Member

Date Joined Jun 1999
Total Posts : 4984

Posted 11/24/2016 1:15 PM (GMT -6)

Sorry, I just updated my signature. I'm using a Lexmark MS415dn printer and it has worked well until now in 25.1. No other program seems to have any trouble with the printer, including 2014.5.

I was testing different settings while writing this and, thanks to Wiggy (again!), I discovered that in the print dialog Color Matching was set to ColorSync. I changed this to the other setting, 'in printer' and now the printout is as it should be. Strange that ColorSync has been selected in the Finale print dialogs for as long as I can remember (also in 2014.5) and it has never caused this problem. I wonder if many other users are having problems with this. It is something people could easily overlook, or blame on the printer.

Vaughan

Finale 3.2 - 25.1, Sibelius 4 - 7
Patterson's plugins, Tobias' plugins, full version, waiting for Jari's plugin update
MacOS 10.12
MacPro (2016) 16 GB, MacBookPro (2011) 8 GB

Amsterdam

MikeHalloran
Registered Member

Date Joined Oct 2001
Total Posts : 217

Posted 11/24/2016 5:02 PM (GMT -6)

Since printing is handled differently in 25, by Finale and no longer the OS, this is not much of a surprise.

Glad you got it figured out. Having HP printers, I wouldn't know what to look for in a Lexmark. HP uses its own terminology which can be quite confusing at times.

Finale 25.1, 2014.5, 2011c, SmartScore X Pro II, Encore 5.07, GPO 5
2010 iMac i7, 32G RAM, 2T SSD, Late 2013 MacBook Air, OS 10.12.1
MOTU Digital Performer 9.12, 9.02, Logic Pro X 10.2.4

Vaughan
Registered Member

Date Joined Jun 1999
Total Posts : 4984

Posted 11/24/2016 5:44 PM (GMT -6)

I still have my old HP Laserjet and when I had to replace it with a newer model, the quality of its replacement was considerably inferior, so I went back to Lexmark, which I'd years before sworn off of due to its being Mac unfriendly. I'm quite happy with this new one, though.

Interesting about Finale taking over the print process from the OS. I wasn't aware of this. What I was aware of was that when I sent PDFs to certain publishing houses, they complained that the PDFs weren't pure black and I got used to running them through Apple's ColorSync Utility to produce generic PDF-X3 documents. Does the change in Finale 25 make this extra step redundant?

Vaughan

Finale 3.2 - 25.1, Sibelius 4 - 7
Patterson's plugins, Tobias' plugins, full version, waiting for Jari's plugin update
MacOS 10.12
MacPro (2016) 16 GB, MacBookPro (2011) 8 GB

Amsterdam

Dr. Wiggy
Early music: modern methods

Date Joined Jun 2006
Total Posts : 12628

Posted 11/25/2016 2:32 AM (GMT -6)

Vaughan said...
Interesting about Finale taking over the print process from the OS. I wasn't aware of this.

I'm not quite sure what is meant by this. Finale passes its data to OS X's printing system, CUPS, just as it always used to, and just like every other app.

If you Save a Postscript file from Finale's print menu, you will find the following line near the start of the file:

%%Creator: (Finale: cgpdftops CUPS filter)

Finale uses a Print Dialog Extension to modify the Print dialog, and this has obviously changed in 25 to include the score/parts options. It's also been updated to Cocoa, rather than the ancient Carbon APIs.

I believe there are still a few colour items in Finale's output, so best carry on with the PDF-X conversion. I have a Finder Service that makes PDF files PDF-X conforming, which I can send you, if you like. It's a lot quicker than using the ColorSync Utility.

Finale v.25.1, 2012 MacMini; 2012 MacBook Pro (10.11.6 / 10.12.1)
Edirol FA-66; Roland A-49, HP Laserjet 5200 DTN
Ancient Groove Music www.ancientgroove.co.uk

Vaughan
Registered Member

Date Joined Jun 1999
Total Posts : 4984

Posted 11/25/2016 3:56 AM (GMT -6)

Thank you, Wiggy. The Finder Service sounds most convenient. Will it appear under the PDF popup in the print window?

Vaughan

Finale 3.2 - 25.1, Sibelius 4 - 7
Patterson's plugins, Tobias' plugins, full version, waiting for Jari's plugin update
MacOS 10.12
MacPro (2016) 16 GB, MacBookPro (2011) 8 GB

Amsterdam

Dr. Wiggy
Early music: modern methods

Date Joined Jun 2006
Total Posts : 12628

Posted 11/25/2016 4:12 AM (GMT -6)

Vaughan said...
Thank you, Wiggy. The Finder Service sounds most convenient. Will it appear under the PDF popup in the print window?

Services appear in the Finder > Services menu. Also on a right-click on a file. So you can magically convert any existing PDF to PDF-X. However, I do also have a thingy which goes in the print menu.

I'll email them to you.

Finale v.25.1, 2012 MacMini; 2012 MacBook Pro (10.11.6 / 10.12.1)
Edirol FA-66; Roland A-49, HP Laserjet 5200 DTN
Ancient Groove Music www.ancientgroove.co.uk

Vaughan
Registered Member

Date Joined Jun 1999
Total Posts : 4984

Posted 11/25/2016 7:03 AM (GMT -6)

Thank you very much! I like magical conversions.

Vaughan

Finale 3.2 - 25.1, Sibelius 4 - 7
Patterson's plugins, Tobias' plugins, full version, waiting for Jari's plugin update
MacOS 10.12
MacPro (2016) 16 GB, MacBookPro (2011) 8 GB

Amsterdam

dwgalviniii
Registered Member

Date Joined Oct 2011
Total Posts : 24

Posted 11/30/2016 2:29 PM (GMT -6)

None of the above solutions seems to have solved the same problem, which I've been experiencing. I don't have the capability of exporting PDF/X files, and I can't seem to figure out how to do that, either.

dwgalviniii

Peter Thomsen
Registered Member

Date Joined Jun 2000
Total Posts : 8331

Posted 11/30/2016 3:05 PM (GMT -6)

dwgalviniii said...
… I don't have the capability of exporting PDF/X files, and I can't seem to figure out how to do that, either.

To export as a PDFX file via the Print dialog:

1) In the Print dialog, go to the lower left corner, and open the pop up menu PDF.
Do not choose “Save as PDF…”, but rather “Open PDF in Preview”.
You will now see the print job as an un-saved, un-titled PDF window in Preview.

2) Hit Command-S to save as a PDF file.
At the bottom of the directory dialog box there is a pop up menu called Quartz-filter.

3) in the Quartz-filter menu, choose “Create Generic PDFX-3 Document”.

Peter

Mac Finale, 2012c, 2014d & 2014.5, Dolet 6.6 plug-in, Mac OS X 10.11.6, iMac Intel Core i7, 2.93 GHz, 16 GB RAM

dwgalviniii
Registered Member

Date Joined Oct 2011
Total Posts : 24

Posted 11/30/2016 3:38 PM (GMT -6)

While slightly less-pronounced, the problem most definitely still persists. :(

dwgalviniii

Dr. Wiggy
Early music: modern methods

Date Joined Jun 2006
Total Posts : 12628

Posted 11/30/2016 4:33 PM (GMT -6)

It may yet be some print setting or facet of the printer driver. Either look for settings that might need changing: anything else relating to colour, resolution or image quality; Or create a new print queue (what OS X calls "adding a printer") for a dummy device, and make PDFs from there. The PDFs may print better, even on the old print queue settings.

Finale v.25.1, 2012 MacMini; 2012 MacBook Pro (10.11.6 / 10.12.1)
Edirol FA-66; Roland A-49, HP Laserjet 5200 DTN
Ancient Groove Music www.ancientgroove.co.uk

Vaughan
Registered Member

Date Joined Jun 1999
Total Posts : 4984

Posted 12/2/2016 1:09 PM (GMT -6)

Do you by any chance have print display colours selected?

Vaughan

Finale 3.2 - 25.1, Sibelius 4 - 7
Patterson's plugins, Tobias' plugins, full version, waiting for Jari's plugin update
MacOS 10.12
MacPro (2016) 16 GB, MacBookPro (2011) 8 GB

Amsterdam

dwgalviniii
Registered Member

Date Joined Oct 2011
Total Posts : 24

Posted 12/2/2016 1:12 PM (GMT -6)

No, I do not.

dwgalviniii

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