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Ed Kalish
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Total Posts : 56
  		   Posted 6/13/2015 7:49 AM (GMT -6)    Quote This PostAlert An Admin About This Post.
Dear Forum Friends: I am seeking advice on a difficult issue, and confess to being of two minds about the matter. I have a large body of compositions which I'd like to publish on an internet site. The basic question is this (and I realize that I must be the one to ultimately answer it): should it be displayed in such a manner that I can retain control over its dispersion (and perhaps benefit tangibly from it)? It seems that if each piece were displayed on the site in part, for example, that interested parties could contact me for the entirety, and perhaps there could be a charge of some sort associated with granting permission for use (or duplicating them here, and sending them). I also thought that posting synthesizer-generated audio files with each piece that are renderings of the entire piece might give users a good sense of the whole composition, even if there manuscripts themselves were only displayed in part.

The work includes sacred choral pieces, songs (piano & voice), instrumental pieces, etc.

Any feedback/thoughts would be helpful, and much appreciated.

Thanks!

Ed
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Andrew M Ladd
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Total Posts : 13
  		   Posted 6/13/2015 8:48 AM (GMT -6)    Quote This PostAlert An Admin About This Post.
Hi Ed

Yes I agree it's so easy to publish on the web for free but you've no idea who has it or what they're doing with it.

Why not have a look at this site,
http://www.musicaneo.com

Regards

Andrew
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Ed Kalish
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  		   Posted 6/13/2015 9:23 AM (GMT -6)    Quote This PostAlert An Admin About This Post.
Many thanks, Andrew. I'll look at this site immediately!
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Truman H.
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  		   Posted 6/14/2015 8:50 PM (GMT -6)    Quote This PostAlert An Admin About This Post.
It's easy enough to truncate the last 1/2 or whatever portion of a piece/movement. Then put the shortened version up as PDF, maybe along with the entire piece in synthesized audio. The potential buyer can then get some idea of what you're doing from the PDF and you're protected from use of the whole thing (theft) without whatever remuneration you ask. It's what I do.

"Standing on one leg, several times a day"
OS X Ver. 10.10.3 iMac14.2
Finale 2014d.v5545

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Ed Kalish
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  		   Posted 6/15/2015 8:55 AM (GMT -6)    Quote This PostAlert An Admin About This Post.
Can you say a bit to me about how you truncate a piece? Thanks very much for posting! -Ed
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Truman H.
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  		   Posted 6/15/2015 9:09 AM (GMT -6)    Quote This PostAlert An Admin About This Post.
1. open the piece/movement in Finale; let's say it's 200 measures long called mypiece.mus(x)
2. Use save-as to save the file with a new name, maybe mypiece.half.mus(x)
3. Select the last 100 measures (or whatever you like), and delete them
4. Print mypiece.half.mus(x) to a PDF file, mypiece.half.pdf
5. Put the new PDF file up on your web site
Hope this helps...

"Standing on one leg, several times a day"
OS X Ver. 10.10.3 iMac14.2
Finale 2014d.v5545
M-Audio KeyRig 49

Post Edited (flamingo) : 6/15/2015 9:19:01 AM (GMT-5)

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Vaughan
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  		   Posted 6/15/2015 9:26 AM (GMT -6)    Quote This PostAlert An Admin About This Post.
Why not just print to PDF and select the page range you want to put on the web? No need to create a truncated Finale file.

Vaughan

Finale 3.2 - 2014d, Sibelius 4 - 7
Tobias Giesen's plugins, full version, Robert Patterson plugins, Dolet 6 plugin
MacOS 10.10.2
MacPro 6GB, MacBookPro (2011) 8GB

Amsterdam

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OCTO.
The radical answers.



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Total Posts : 2659
  		   Posted 6/15/2015 2:44 PM (GMT -6)    Quote This PostAlert An Admin About This Post.
Vaughan said...
Why not just print to PDF and select the page range you want to put on the web? No need to create a truncated Finale file.


:))

You will get a beer!!

Finale 2009c now (works better than 2011c) on OS X 10.6.8 and not thinking to upgrade any more until both computers die completely (iMac 21', MacBook Pro 13').

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Dr. Wiggy
Early music: modern methods



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  		   Posted 6/15/2015 4:07 PM (GMT -6)    Quote This PostAlert An Admin About This Post.
Ed Kalish said...
it should it be displayed in such a manner that I can retain control over its dispersion (and perhaps benefit tangibly from it)

There's no guarantee of control even with printed copies. A customer bought a full score, a set of parts, and ONE vocal score. She then emailed me to say that the person photocopying it had lost the copy: could I send another one before their first rehearsal. eyes

"This is me helping."

Finale 2014d, 2012 MacMini; 2012 MacBook Pro (10.10.3)
Edirol FA-66; Roland A-49, HP Laserjet 5200 DTN
Ancient Groove Music www.ancientgroove.co.uk

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Ed Kalish
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Date Joined Jan 2015
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  		   Posted 6/15/2015 6:57 PM (GMT -6)    Quote This PostAlert An Admin About This Post.
Many thanks to the Finale Forum community! You guys are too much! The input is really valuable. I've got to give all of this an intelligent think. Appreciate your taking the time to offer these suggestions! -Ed
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tbmartin
Yuba-Meister



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Total Posts : 1684
  		   Posted 6/16/2015 1:01 PM (GMT -6)    Quote This PostAlert An Admin About This Post.
Wiggy said...
There's no guarantee of control even with printed copies. A customer bought a full score, a set of parts, and ONE vocal score. She then emailed me to say that the person photocopying it had lost the copy: could I send another one before their first rehearsal. eyes

"I'd be happy to send you a new copy. As an added benefit, I'll have it delivered with a summons for copyright violations.

Terence
Saxophone Quartet Arranger
Using Finale 2003a, Windows XP Pro and Vista

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peerlessnerd
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  		   Posted 6/16/2015 3:26 PM (GMT -6)    Quote This PostAlert An Admin About This Post.
Many publishing companies today sell "unlimited duplication masters," particularly of choral music. They snail mail one copy of the entire piece. The user makes as many copies as needed. After the final concert, all parts are collected, and the copies destroyed. The masters are retained until needed again.

It certainly cuts down the storage space needed to house hundreds of pieces.

No, it is not a perfect system. Prices for duplication masters vary wildly depending on the piece. Choral octavos are generally $2.50 per copy in the USA, which most music directors are willing to pay as a flat fee for each copy they intend to make. Prices per piece can be calculated based on the size of the group.

Using this method the composer/publisher retains a tiny bit of control, as opposed to posting PDFs for download. Unfortunately, today PDFs equal FREE in the mind of most people on the Internet.

Finale 2014d
Early 2008 Mac Pro Quad-Core 3,1
Yosemite 10.10.3

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Ed Kalish
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  		   Posted 6/16/2015 7:33 PM (GMT -6)    Quote This PostAlert An Admin About This Post.
So, "peerlessnerd"..., I'm trying to understand your post: are you speaking of two options: paying, say, a high price of some sort for permanent use of a duplication master, versus $2.50/copy of a choral octavo which would be ordered in bulk from the publisher? Thanks. -Ed
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Ed Kalish
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  		   Posted 6/16/2015 7:37 PM (GMT -6)    Quote This PostAlert An Admin About This Post.
To Andrew M. Ladd: http://www.musicaneo.com charges the composer ONE THIRD of anything he/she makes on their site. That seems like quite a hunk, wouldn't you say...? Or is that the going rate. After all, the other thing that artists do other than writing, is... starving, right? blush
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peerlessnerd
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  		   Posted 6/16/2015 10:08 PM (GMT -6)    Quote This PostAlert An Admin About This Post.
Ed K

Yes, these publishers usually have a flat fee for unlimited duplication masters, typically $50-100 U.S. for most pieces they offer in online catalogs that can be quite extensive. Primarily the publishers are in the choral education market to high schools, colleges, universities, churches, and community groups.

Others vary the price for the duplication masters depending on how many copies the music director claims to need, but never less than $50-100.

If the piece is for chorus with full orchestra, obviously the prices can escalate signicantly. BTW, these publishers are squeaky-clean copyright legal. If they can't get the rights, they don't publish or market.

In the old days you would sell your piece outright to Warner Brothers, and you'd be fortunate to get 15% of the proceeds. You would lose the publication rights to your piece permanently! It would be their property, not yours.

With no mega-corporation "middle man" you will get a much better percentage of sales. But you won't get mass mailings to every school in North America either.

Some publishers email PDFs, but most snail mail hard copies for duplication. PDFs can and do spread globally on the Internet like wildfire, entirely out of your control. Most organizations don't have the time or initiative to make PDFs of you duplication masters. That extra step really seems to help keep your piece a bit more within your control.

Also, many music directors HATE being forced to take the time to download, print, and organize PDFs. They actually prefer printed duplication masters.

Another avenue would be the rental market, though mostly for large-scale works like symphonies or Broadway musicals. Rates are based on the number of performances and the seating capacity of the venue. It is not unusual for pieces to cost $500-1500 per performance depending on the reputation of the composer.

As composer of rental pieces, you send all the necessary parts, which are then returned to you with any pencil notations by the musicians erased.

Yes, in many respects this all represents the "honor system." I think you will find the vast majority to be very truthful, honest, and forthcoming. But, you will get burned on occasion too...

Finale 2014d
Early 2008 Mac Pro Quad-Core 3,1
Yosemite 10.10.3

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