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Shing-kwei
Registered Member

Date Joined Dec 2006
Total Posts : 190

Posted 4/20/2016 9:36 AM (GMT -6)

Dear friends,
How can I import a XML file to Finale in multiple staves? I use openMusic to create a "voice" then export to XML file in 4 staves ( GGFF -- treble oct. high, treble, bass,bass oct. low), when I import to Finale, it transfers in one staff only, can I have a multi staves ( better solution) ? thanks!!

best

Shing-kwei

File Attachment :
gagaku-xml-1.xml 136KB (text/xml)

This file has been downloaded 392 time(s).

File Attachment :
gagaku-xml2finale.mus 6KB (application/octet-stream)

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michelp
Registered Member

Date Joined Aug 2003
Total Posts : 2232

Posted 4/20/2016 11:16 AM (GMT -6)

I don't know openMusic, but did you create 4 staves with a different midi channel ?

Michel
Finale 2014.5, 2014d, 2012c (main), 2011c, 2010b, 2009b, MacOsX 10.9.5, Mac Mini Intel Core i7 2,7 Ghz, 16 Go Ram, French azerty kb, Dolet 6. Full TGTools. MOTU Audio Express, 3 monitors.

Michael Good
MusicXML Maven

Date Joined May 2000
Total Posts : 1299

Posted 4/20/2016 11:46 AM (GMT -6)

Please let openMusic know about this. The file they export that you attached here has just one staff, so there is nothing that Finale can do during MusicXML import. Maybe there's already an option somewhere in openMusic that does this?

Michael Good
VP of MusicXML Technologies
MakeMusic, Inc.

Zuill
"The Troll"

Date Joined Oct 2003
Total Posts : 29077

Posted 4/20/2016 3:46 PM (GMT -6)

Both of those files are a total mess. Never mind multiple staves. If the notes were proper and on one staff, it could be exploded. But not this file. It's beyond help. Can you try saving the xml file again? Maybe try exporting a MIDI file and see what happens there.

Zuill

"When all is said and done, more is said than done."

Win 7 64bit, 2011b, 2012c, 2014d, 2014.5

Favorite Forum quote: "Please, everybody, IGNORE THE TROLL!"

Shing-kwei
Registered Member

Date Joined Dec 2006
Total Posts : 190

Posted 4/22/2016 8:21 AM (GMT -6)

thanks! all.
may be it's a stuff of openMusic.
SK.

Mike Halloran
Registered Member

Date Joined Jun 2009
Total Posts : 105

Posted 4/24/2016 6:41 PM (GMT -6)

Are referring to open Music Score, openmusicscore.org/ or openMusic repmus.ircam.fr/openmusic/home ?

If open Music Score, the issue is unlikely to be their web site. It's whatever program the uploader used to create the score.

Although Finale, Sibelius and MuseScore support MusicXML 3, many other programs do not and support older versions instead. Passport's Encore, for example, supports MusicXML 1.x (1.3, I think) which does export multiple staves but not lyrics nor most expressions etc. Frustrating because, when creating choral parts or lead sheets, I prefer the way that Encore handles lyric entry.

Whoever uploaded the score that's giving you grief used something too simple, too old or both. You can't fix that.

Recently, for kicks, I tried exporting and importing the same score from Finale 2014.5 into Sibelius 8, MuseScore 2.02 and SmartScore X 2 v.10.5.8 — and then back again. No two programs handled it the same and when I was done, it was a mess. MusicXML is great but it makes a huge difference how it is integrated into a notation program.

openMusic is a programming environment for the creation of notation rather than a notation program such as Finale. If I am reading openMusic documentation, it is up to the user to determine how he/she wishes to integrate MusicXML:

MusicXML is a new standard for storing musical objects including rhythmic and other high-level musical information.

Is is the priviledged and recommeded format in OM to import/export voice and poly objects and interchange with software such as Finale or Sibelius.

Mike Halloran

Finale 2014.5, SmartScore X Pro II, Encore 5.0.7
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Post Edited (Mike Halloran) : 4/24/2016 6:55:54 PM (GMT-5)

Mike Halloran
Registered Member

Date Joined Jun 2009
Total Posts : 105

Posted 4/24/2016 6:57 PM (GMT -6)

Weird that I cannot capitalize the letter O in open

Charles Lawrence
Registered Member

Date Joined Dec 2009
Total Posts : 3638

Posted 4/24/2016 10:55 PM (GMT -6)

Mike Halloran said...
Weird that I cannot capitalize the letter O in open

This has been a known bug in the forum for some time now.

"Anything is possible if you don't know what you are talking about!"

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Peter Thomsen
Registered Member

Date Joined Jun 2000
Total Posts : 8331

Posted 4/25/2016 12:35 AM (GMT -6)

You can work around the bug by entering non-displaying formatting after the uppercase O,
e. g.
O{Italic ON}{Italic OFF}pen

Peter

Mac Finale, 2012c, 2014d & 2014.5, Dolet 6.6 plug-in, Mac OS X 10.9.5, iMac Intel Core i7, 2.93 GHz, 16 GB RAM

Shing-kwei
Registered Member

Date Joined Dec 2006
Total Posts : 190

Posted 4/30/2016 7:49 AM (GMT -6)

Hello colleagues,
thanks for very profitable discussions.
I have imported XML of voice / openMusic, it was much clear but only one staff and translated one octave higher. ( ref. attachments only mm. 5~6)
I have been told that Sibelius can import XML of voice / OM in multiple staves, eventually the team developer of Finale can join the discussion of openMusic and ask OM administartor about the relationship between Finale and OM ( special in XML import / export). here is the link.
http://www.forumnet.ircam.fr/user-groups/openmusic/forum/topic/om-questions/

Maybe Finale development needs some Lisp Music Notation logic? (* frank and naive thinking)

Shing-kwei

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voice.png 39KB (image/png)

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Charles Lawrence
Registered Member

Date Joined Dec 2009
Total Posts : 3638

Posted 4/30/2016 9:08 AM (GMT -6)

As has been stated here, there is nothing wrong with Finale importing multiple staves via MusicXML. Your source file is FUBAR, contains data for only one staff, and stands no chance of being imported correctly by any MusicXML import. Even the inventor of MusicXML, Michael Good, now an employee of MakeMusic, posted earlier in this thread with a suggestion that you communicate your issue with openMusic.

"Anything is possible if you don't know what you are talking about!"

Windows 10 Professional (x64) (build 10586)

3.50 gigahertz Intel Core i7-5930K, Multi-core (6 total), Hyper-threaded (12 total)

32638 Megabytes Usable Installed Memory, 17514.37 Gigabytes Usable Hard Drive Capacity
NVIDIA GeForce GTX 980 - 4GB [Display adapter]

ASUS Rampage V Extreme motherboard, Realtek HD Audio

Finale 2014.5.6359
Garritan GPO4.02

Cakewalk SONAR X3 - (X3e build 244) - x64, Sound Forge Audio Studio 10.0, Audacity 2.1.0
Sharpeye 2.68, PhotoScore Ultimate 7.0.2, SmartScore X2 Pro 10.5.8

"There is a world of difference between a person who has a big problem and a person who makes a problem big." – John Maxwell

Post Edited (Charles Lawrence) : 4/30/2016 9:11:34 AM (GMT-5)

Ralph L. Bowers Jr.
Polymathist

Date Joined May 2012
Total Posts : 883

Posted 4/30/2016 9:39 AM (GMT -6)

I don't know how many times you need to be told. But the problem is in how your xml file is created by the other program.

Please see attached png from its attempt to import into Sibelius.

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Zuill
"The Troll"

Date Joined Oct 2003
Total Posts : 29077

Posted 4/30/2016 9:39 AM (GMT -6)

Even if that was split into 5 staves, the MIDI data is so unbelievably convoluted that it hardly matters. What is this? It makes no musical sense.

Zuill

"When all is said and done, more is said than done."

Win 7 64bit, 2011b, 2012c, 2014d, 2014.5

Favorite Forum quote: "Please, everybody, IGNORE THE TROLL!"

Shing-kwei
Registered Member

Date Joined Dec 2006
Total Posts : 190

Posted 4/30/2016 10:17 PM (GMT -6)

Hi!
thanks for feedback and useful instruction.
My English is not good enough for understanding and expression, may be there is something misunderstood, let me clarify:
1. I didn't express there is a wrong or fault in Finale. ( - Charles 4/30/2016 9:11:34 AM GMT-5), I believe the import XML to Sibelius of Ralph is ordinary, let me quote the discussion of OM by Paddy ( sorry without permission but I think it's an open Forum) ... If you’re using sibelius for example, you can import the chord in XML and then use the explode function to parse it on different staves. (25, April. 16:31)
...As far as i know you can’t export xml’s from a chord-seq. Just plug your chord-seq into a voice (and adjust the rhythm quantification settings in the preferences if needed) and then use export-musicxml (don’t forget to add the optional inputs with > and set the approx to quarter-tones). (at 21:25 the same day)
Probably we do have the same function in Finale "to parse it on different stave" ? by attach please find the original file of export to XML from Voice / OM. it can be import to Finale.
2. So far from chord-seq to voice then export MusicXML, we are nothing to do with midi, I think midi format is less useful for nation. I am in prepare my composition materials, of course it doesn't make sense in music. ( Zuill, Michelp)

best
Shing-kwei

File Attachment :
gagaku XML-3.xml 138KB (text/xml)

This file has been downloaded 361 time(s).

Ralph L. Bowers Jr.
Polymathist

Date Joined May 2012
Total Posts : 883

Posted 4/30/2016 10:50 PM (GMT -6)

I had a friend once who could never take no for an answer.
Needless to say we parted ways long ago.

Zuill
"The Troll"

Date Joined Oct 2003
Total Posts : 29077

Posted 5/1/2016 1:51 AM (GMT -6)

You can split the one staff into more staves in Finale. However, you have to start with a usable file. The xml you are posting makes no sense, and splitting it into 3, 4, or 5 staves, or more, still makes no sense.

Help us out by posting a pdf of the original file so we can see what it is supposed to look like. Them we might be able to advise with more clarity.

Zuill

"When all is said and done, more is said than done."

Win 7 64bit, 2011b, 2012c, 2014d, 2014.5

Favorite Forum quote: "Please, everybody, IGNORE THE TROLL!"

Shing-kwei
Registered Member

Date Joined Dec 2006
Total Posts : 190

Posted 5/1/2016 2:54 AM (GMT -6)

Here you go! the original voice notation(pdf), XML import to Finale and its pdf.

SK.

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XML import2Finale.png 755KB (image/png)

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File Attachment :
XML import2Finale.musx 88KB (application/octet-stream)

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Zuill
"The Troll"

Date Joined Oct 2003
Total Posts : 29077

Posted 5/1/2016 2:11 PM (GMT -6)

Now that I see your original file, I agree with what Michael Good said earlier: the source program xml file is to blame, not Finale.

Next: what you see in Finale is converting as best as possible what your exported file has. Since the file itself only contains one staff, Finale seems to be doing that. However, it seems like all the notes are (or might be) there. I can't say. Part of the problem is that you've got some microtonal accidentals, which either are not communicated properly in the xml export, or Finale is not able to replicate.

I am still shaking my head as to the notation itself. Is this for a live performance, or merely for recording? It makes no sense to me. I thought maybe something is going wonky, bit it looks like you are creating what you want.

One of the things that tips me off to strangeness is duplicate noteheads at the same pitch throughout. This is often due to importing a MIDI file, or by entering via MIDI when the signal is folding back and duplicating every pitch.

Zuill

"When all is said and done, more is said than done."

Win 7 64bit, 2011b, 2012c, 2014d, 2014.5

Favorite Forum quote: "Please, everybody, IGNORE THE TROLL!"

Shing-kwei
Registered Member

Date Joined Dec 2006
Total Posts : 190

Posted 5/3/2016 2:00 PM (GMT -6)

I think neither XML / openMusic nor Finale should be blamed, I suppose the "Voice" or " Chord-seq" of OM is only one staff but in virtual phanomenon ( it can be 1 ~4 staves, cleves).
I am preparing a raw, rough material neither for a live performance nor for recording.
thank you for your comments and suggestions.
cheers
Shing-kwei

Shing-kwei
Registered Member

Date Joined Dec 2006
Total Posts : 190

Posted 7/14/2016 4:59 AM (GMT -6)

Hello Colleagues,
if you are interested about XML, please explore the website of IRCAM Forum:
http://forumnet.ircam.fr/user-groups/openmusic/forum/topic/musicxml-exported-from-openmusic-is-invalid/#post-18532

best
Shing-kwei

Michael Good
MusicXML Maven

Date Joined May 2000
Total Posts : 1299

Posted 7/15/2016 7:51 PM (GMT -6)

Thanks for the link, Shing-kwei! It is very encouraging to see OpenMusic working on improving their MusicXML export.

Michael Good
VP of MusicXML Technologies
MakeMusic, Inc.

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