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| MakeMusic Forum > Public Forums > Finale - Windows - FORUM HAS MOVED! > How to enter a whole note in 5/4 time | Forum Quick Jump
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Mike Rosen
himself
      
Date Joined Feb 2006
Total Posts : 14146
| Posted 1/25/2013 11:32 AM (GMT -6) |   | | |
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Mike Rosen
himself
Date Joined Feb 2006
Total Posts : 14146
| Posted 1/25/2013 12:06 PM (GMT -6) | | Simply because it can be done. I am not ruling on whether it should be done, or not. If I did, there would be a whole lot of notational practices (particularly in the contemporary field) that I would question, as well.
At some point in the past, I thought we (the forum) would answer the question, while pointing out that it might not be the best solution. Let the poster decide whether to do it, or not.
Mike Rosen
www.specialmillwork.com
WebMaster and bass for the Seattle SeaChordsmen www.seachordsmen.org
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Michel R. E.
Registered Member
Date Joined May 2003
Total Posts : 7430
| Posted 1/25/2013 12:06 PM (GMT -6) | | I also ask "why?"
if you make a tuplet over the whole note, why hide the values? what is the point? how is imprecise notation bringing anything to the page?
(I know you're just trying to answer the OP's question, Mike.... I guess we're being devils' advocates... bet you didn't know it was a whole law firm, eh?)
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Charles Lawrence
Registered Member
Date Joined Dec 2009
Total Posts : 3638
| Posted 1/25/2013 12:57 PM (GMT -6) | | Motet,
Yes, but would not correct playback, i.e. a full 5 beats for the whole note still be a problem.
Ron,
It looks like your method of the whole note tuplet, but hide the number and bracket, it the best solution that fits both the look and playback. It would not be a source of confusion to me for a notated single whole note in 5/4 to be held for 5 beats, similar to a whole rest in a 5/4 measure to represent 5 beats, or similarly a whole rest in a 3/4 measure to represent only 3 beats. Just my opinion. I don't think I've ever encountered such a 5/4 whole note in practice, though.
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RMK
Registered Member
Date Joined Mar 1999
Total Posts : 187
| Posted 1/25/2013 12:58 PM (GMT -6) | | I saw a notation once where the composer put a rhythm dot on the "wrong" side of the note (i.e. the left side) to indicate the addition of a quarter of the note it was attached to. So, one of these dots added to a whole note would indicate 5 beats.
I think it is a bad idea. | | Back to Top | |
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Ron.
Composer
Date Joined Mar 2003
Total Posts : 8828
| Posted 1/25/2013 1:56 PM (GMT -6) | | Charles Lawrence said...
Motet,
Yes, but would not correct playback, i.e. a full 5 beats for the whole note still be a problem.
Ron,
It looks like your method of the whole note tuplet, but hide the number and bracket, it the best solution that fits both the look and playback. It would not be a source of confusion to me for a notated single whole note in 5/4 to be held for 5 beats, similar to a whole rest in a 5/4 measure to represent 5 beats, or similarly a whole rest in a 3/4 measure to represent only 3 beats. Just my opinion. I don't think I've ever encountered such a 5/4 whole note in practice, though.
If I encountered a single whole note in a 5/4 measure and no rests in sight, I would stop playing and ask the conduction where he would like me to put the rest: before the whole note, after it, or in the middle somewhere. But then, I'm a born Smart A**.
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Michel R. E.
Registered Member
Date Joined May 2003
Total Posts : 7430
| Posted 1/25/2013 3:01 PM (GMT -6) | | Charles Lawrence said...Ron. said...
I would stop playing and ask the conduction [sic] where he would like me to put the rest: before the whole note, after it, or in the middle somewhere.
The conductor might just tell you to hold the note out for 5 beats! 
And in that instant you have wasted precious time and money in your rehearsal.
Do you KNOW that the conductor would also see this as an "oh, this must be one of those 5-beat whole notes"?
The conductor might waste time trying to see if there isn't something missing form the measure as well.
Wasted time = wasted money = wasted rehearsal = bad engraving.
Finale (started with ver. 3.0) 2010, 2011, 2012b installed
Win XP
basically ALL Garritan sounds, plus XSample Chamber Ensemble.
"There are two novels that can change a bookish fourteen-year old's life: The Lord of the Rings and Atlas Shrugged. One is a childish fantasy that often engenders a lifelong obsession with its unbelievable heroes, leading to an emotionally stunted, socially crippled adulthood, unable to deal with the real world. The other, of course, involves orcs." ~John Rogers | | Back to Top | |
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ttw
Registered Member
Date Joined Nov 2005
Total Posts : 776
| Posted 1/25/2013 6:25 PM (GMT -6) | |
Mircea said... What about us inventing and proposing a way of notating a full measure note. An variation of the whole note that would mean "play this measure throughout" in any meter, just like the whole measure rest. We (if found for the better of writing music) should include new notation ideas in the format of the old. Too many "new age" scoring techniques that stick for only one piece are accepted, why not something that adds to the traditional way of writing music? But we have to move fast to be of any use for Reuben Ware. 
Longa and maxima come to mind.
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Mike Rosen
himself
Date Joined Feb 2006
Total Posts : 14146
| Posted 1/25/2013 6:36 PM (GMT -6) | | Ron. said...
If I encountered a single whole note in a 5/4 measure and no rests in sight, I would stop playing and ask the conduction where he would like me to put the rest: before the whole note, after it, or in the middle somewhere.
Or, he would tell you EXACTLY where to put it, much like why there is an angel on top of a Christmas tree... 
Mike Rosen
www.specialmillwork.com
WebMaster and bass for the Seattle SeaChordsmen www.seachordsmen.org
FINALE TIPS at www.specialmillwork.com/finaletips.htm
Finale 2010, 2011, 2012c on Mac 10.8.2
Simple Entry, QWERTY keyboard. That's my system, and I'm stickin' to it.
"As a musician, he's a damn fine woodworker." | | Back to Top | |
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