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Credo
Registered Member
      
Date Joined Feb 2016
Total Posts : 142
| Posted 9/18/2016 5:49 AM (GMT -6) |   | nordensten said...Credo said...
or build HP settings that simply 'hop channels' (as opposed to sending a key-switch) to the appropriate bowing style. For me this second approach makes more sense, as I can keep all of the bowing styles and effects loaded and spread out in ARIA instances, For me, this approch worked fine in Finale 2012c, but was broken in 2014 and 2014.5. Haven't yet tested it in V25. Does it work for you? (Staff's channel, relative channel changes in HP)
While it's not perfect, and sometimes confusing, it does work here, and did in 2014.5 for me as well (Used channel hopping a good bit to get around some issues with MIDI program changes that could cause crashes in Halion 5). I usually give exact channels rather than relatives for Human Playback filters. I'm not sure why, but sometimes I find I need to subtract a channel number when punching things into text boxes.
I.E. I built an HP text filtered expression....expecting a channel entry of 17 to play an instrument assigned to channel 1 of Bank 2, but it played the instrument on channel 16 of Bank 1 instead.
I.E. Asking for Channel 1 played Channel 2 instead.
Strange stuff, but in these cases, if I just tell myself Finale has decided to number things starting with 0 instead of 1 (subtract 1)....it then works. I suspect some of these quirks might have to do with what soundsets (not the HP filters, but the instrument layouts) one has installed in Finale! Just a guess though...................I'd have to strip them all out of my installation and start with a blank slate, gradually adding soundsets back in to confirm my 'theory' on this.
In contrast, if I elect to assign a channel directly to an expression instead of parsing the expression through an HP filter....channel numbering works as expected, beginning with 1, on through 128.
These were little annoying inconsistencies that I have run across...but after a head scratching moment it didn't take me long to figure out what was going on and make adjustments.
Note that it's sometimes easier to just build a text expression rather than going through HP.Post Edited (Credo) : 9/18/2016 7:53:39 AM (GMT-5) | | Back to Top | |
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Credo
Registered Member
Date Joined Feb 2016
Total Posts : 142
| Posted 9/18/2016 3:40 PM (GMT -6) | | sandalwood said...Credo said...
or build HP settings that simply 'hop channels' (as opposed to sending a key-switch) to the appropriate bowing style. For me this second approach makes more sense, as I can keep all of the bowing styles and effects loaded and spread out in ARIA instances, Trying to follow the discussions, I was thinking you meant loading various GOS string articulations to distinct ARIA channels and then moving from one to other via the Utilities>Change Instrument command. However, I gather you mean MIDI channels not ARIA channels. and what do you mean by "build[ing] HP settings" in this context?
First I should clarify that when I mention 'HP Filters" I was referring to what Finale refers to as "Techniques". These are found in the Menu: Edit\Preferences\Human Play Back.
When I made those posts yesterday I was NOT looking at Finale to recall the official term. Inside Techniques one can assign all sorts of 'filters' to get better control of the 'priority' that Finale will take into account before executing a 'Technique'.
Yes, ARIA slots are addressed by MIDI channel. By default you get 1 - 16 in order, but ARIA will also allow you to change the Channel of a given slot. ARIA will even allow you to set several slots to the 'same' MIDI channel to build custom sections out of solo instruments, or special 'layered' instruments. It also has an 'OM' (Omni Mode) that can be set per slot if you want an instrument to respond to ANY and ALL of the 16 possible channels coming into the ARIA instance at a given moment.
Example:
Take an ARIA Instance in Bank 1 of Finale and load individual bow styles:
1. Sustains
2. Martele
3. Sautille
4. Spiccato
5. Pizzicato
In Preferences/Human Playback one can build "Techniques/filters" that will respond to various markings or text patterns in a stave. You could have it send a key switch, a CC message, Change MIDI channels, etc. I think you can get up to three events per HP event (I.E. have it switch channels, AND send two CC messages), and add 'filters' according to things like stave name, library name, MIDI patch number, etc.
In the case above, I'd disable the stuff that came with GPO5 for the Key Switching variants of Garritan Orchestral Strings (just click the boxes beside them in the HP list so there is NOT a check mark in them), and build my own folder with filters that would instead change to these independently loaded bow styles on demand.
I can assign various score symbols and/or expression text that will swap in real time between channels 1-5
The advantage in doing this instead of just using the KS based set of "Techniques" that came with GPO5, is that one can open ARIA and tweak out 'each bow style' for the best sound given the style and tempo of your piece. You can give things like Pizzicato plucking or Staccato bowing a nice long release time (as opposed to having it abruptly get 'cut short' due to a key switch), while clamping down on the arco sustains for a more crisp and responsive sounding string section. You could pull the tone down a bit for Martele strokes to get it to blend better with a lush passage, and crank it up for more aggressive passages. For plucked strings which work based on velocity, you can fiddle with the 'velocity tracking' to force the kind of blend you want given the dynamics of everything else going on around your pizzicato/col legno passages. It really opens up possibilities to more easily take advantage of the samples in ways they actually sound natural. It also allows you to 'build' variations of bow actions (I.E. Possibly create a Detache Petite by tweaking the attack/delay/release/tone settings of the included Detache Grande instrument).
To some degree it's possible to change all this with KS instruments too, but it's going to take a ton of CC messages being sent for almost every single note, AND, you won't get as much control over the 'release time' of every note in a fast passage that you could by spreading the bow styles out over dedicated ARIA slots. If you pry it all apart across several instrument slots, then you'll be able to pull up ARIA and see exactly where a bow style is set, experiment with the settings while listening to a score, and when you find settings you like, you can 'save them' through ARIA itself as complete 'ensemble sets' for future use, and also use the MIDI tool in Finale to attach relevant CC messages to a stave when and where real time changes are desired.
Personally, I find that I need quite a few variations throughout a piece! I even need multiple variants of sustained instruments....out of the box with GOS strings you get a kind of muddly 'swell' for every arco attack that doesn't always fit! Fortunately, we can bypass the KS variant and pry things apart to get control of that 'attack/sustain/decay' quality of the sustains so the library is useful with many styles of orchestration. We can also get more control over how note transitions during 'legato' bowing is interpreted when playing back a score.
As for your initial understanding....
That method of manually 'changing instruments' for a given stave in a single ARIA instrument slot should also be possible if your PC is fast enough and the changes aren't so rapid that it makes things sound strange in some way (using this method in a rapid passage that mixes legato and staccato marked notes would lead to the same sorts of issues as using a KS variant of an instrument....less control over release times for individual bow styles). I personally just channel hop between preloaded instruments given my older/slower computer.
Note, one can also apply commands directly to symbols or text expressions that have nothing to do with Human Playback preferences. I.E. You can use the expression tool, then select or create an expression based on text/symbols/whatever, and assign a CC, Channel Change, Program Change, Velocity Change, Tempo Setting, etc....directly to the expression.Post Edited (Credo) : 9/18/2016 5:07:54 PM (GMT-5) | | Back to Top | |
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sandalwood
Registered Member
Date Joined Feb 2015
Total Posts : 47
| Posted 9/18/2016 9:05 PM (GMT -6) | | OK, I'm doing some reading and some testing in Finale. Meanwhile let me try to rephrase what I was saying above:
Instead of loading Violins 1 KS, for instance, to a single channel/slot of an ARIA instance, we load several Violins 1 articulations to several distinct channels/slots of ARIA (this enables us to tweak each one's ARIA Instrument Control knobs separately to our liking, where applicable). Violins 1 is notated on a single staff and whenever the articulation needs to change, a Change Instrument (or, as you say, a specially created text expression) command directs the playback to the appropriate channel/slot of the ARIA.
I hope this is basically correct. Now I'm trying to explore the possibilities the HP Instr. Techniques will offer within this scheme.
Finale 2014.5, Notion 5, GPO5, Miroslav Philharmonik
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