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| MakeMusic Forum > Public Forums > Finale - Windows - FORUM HAS MOVED! > Editing of lyrics | Forum Quick Jump
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Zuill
"The Troll"
      
Date Joined Oct 2003
Total Posts : 29077
| Posted 11/9/2013 9:38 AM (GMT -6) |   | If you were typing into score and doing each stave separately, there's a good chance all the lyrics are in verse 1 and quite a jumbled mess. I generally enter all my lyrics first into the lyric window, then click into the score. I just completed an SATB score. I entered all the lyrics for each staff into a different verse, then clicked the lyrics into the score. Even though there were similarities in each voice, there were differences as well. I have been doing it this way for over 15 years, and keep extremely good order in lyrics, with excellent results.
That's what I recommend you to do. You might have to start fresh to make it easier. Cleaning up a lyric mess usually takes me much longer. The messes I end up cleaning up are not in my scores, but in scores that have been sent to me for fixing. I am amazed at how many Finale users have such a hard time entering lyrics properly. If we can see a file, we can probably advise as to what the problem is.
Zuill
"When all is said and done, more is said than done."
Finale 2002b, 2003a, 2004b, 2005b, Win XP SP3, 2011b Win 7 64bit, 2012a Bought and Paid For (Hopefully soon 2012b with some of the MAJOR BUGS fixed--well, now with 2012b and some of the bugs are fixed) 2012c, with some bug fixes. 2014 now.
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Simon Furey
Registered Member
Date Joined Nov 2001
Total Posts : 202
| Posted 11/9/2013 6:51 PM (GMT -6) | | Anthony,
The big problem with Zuill's method of using verses for voices is when you have multiple verses, because then you have a conflict between verses and voices. I accept that you might devise a convention where (say) Soprano=verse 1,2,3 etc., Alto=verse 11,12,13, Tenor=verse 21,22, 23 etc. and so on. However, be aware that each verse has a different vertical position in the score, for obvious reasons, and that messes up the layout, which you then have to fiddle with. (A crafty way of dealing with this if you have only two- or three-part harmony might be to use "Verse" for voice 1, "Chorus" for voice 2 and "Section" for voice 3. What a pity MM didn't put in a fourth category... suggestion for product enhancement?) Otherwise, I completely agree with what he says. For example, I am at one with him on pre-preparing the lyrics using the lyrics window (and then use click-assign), but what I do where possible is use the same verse for each voice, then if there is a typo, one change will sort all four voices at once, in the simple case where all four are singing the same words in parallel. Also, when typing in I lay the text out to follow the strophic form of the words (typically it's some form of poem set to music, so it's straightforward.) to make it easier to follow afterwards. However, it's rarely as easy as that, because frequently at least one voice doesn't have exactly the same words as the rest. What I do in such cases is to insert an extra voice-specific whole line (or lines) of the poem, because I have found this more reliable if there are later changes to be made. Sometimes in a verse I have to go to the extreme of typing in four full sets of words, one for each voice, prefixed with the name of the voice for identification purposes. It's worth noting that with click-assign you can start where you like, so you can comment your lyrics freely.
Also, taking "short cuts" and going back over to click on existing words elsewhere in the lyrics window to save typing may be tempting but just piles up trouble for the future. My advice is don't do it; type the words in again where you need them, using cut-and-paste where necessary to speed up the process.
I have tried and abandoned the "shift syllables left" and "shift syllables right" facilities, because in my experience they cause more problems than they solve. Later editing is always a problem, I have found, and I just have to live with careful checking and tidying-up where necessary. I always make lyrics changes in the lyrics window, so that if there is some undesirable consequence (such as a syllable shift) it is relatively easy to fix in the lyrics window and you can verify the results immediately in the main score window . It does help to put in all of the text strictly in order, duplicating where necessary. Do not be tempted to change lyrics text in the score directly, because there is at least one trap for the unwary: if you delete a word directly in the score, you delete it from the lyrics completely, and that causes all manner of syllable shifts, as a result of which you can have hell's own job undoing the mess, especially as (I find) CTRL-Z undo often doesn't work to repair the damage. Instead, you should do as Derrek suggests and clear the lyrics from the offending bar/measure using "Clear selected items" and then click-assign them anew. This is by far the most reliable method.
As for elisions, we discussed this in another thread recently. Unfortunately, the elision character is not found in most fonts (certainly none of those that I use for text), so what I do - and I can hear the purists raising their hands in horror here - is use an underlined hard space instead. This means that what I have in the lyrics window is exactly what goes into the score and is consistent, so that I can change font type, size and style thereafter without worrying if the elision character will suddenly become something different.
The above represents about 14 years of doing song lyrics in Allegro and Finale. Not as much as Zuill, perhaps, but hard-won experience nevertheless. I'm sure just about everybody on the Forum will have their own pet ways of doing lyrics in Finale; I am in no way suggesting that mine is the best, but it works for me, and I am continually refining it. I hope it helps you.
Cheers
Simon
Finale 2014/Windows 7 Pro/self built 4Gb Intel 2-core CPU 32 bit
Finale 2012c/Windows 7 Home Premium/Compaq 4Gb AMD 2-core CPU 64 bit | | Back to Top | |
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Zuill
"The Troll"
Date Joined Oct 2003
Total Posts : 29077
| Posted 11/9/2013 8:26 PM (GMT -6) | | Every situation is different. I know there are those who merely type into score. I am just suggesting that keeping each vocal staff in a separate verse keeps things under control. I understand that if there were several verses in each vocal line, the number of verses needed may get extensive. The idea of 1,2,3,4 and then 11, 12, 13, 14 etc. might be a good way to keep track. Each person finds a way to get the job done.
Zuill
"When all is said and done, more is said than done."
Finale 2002b, 2003a, 2004b, 2005b, Win XP SP3, 2011b Win 7 64bit, 2012a Bought and Paid For (Hopefully soon 2012b with some of the MAJOR BUGS fixed--well, now with 2012b and some of the bugs are fixed) 2012c, with some bug fixes. 2014 now.
Favorite Forum quote: "Please, everybody, IGNORE THE TROLL!" | | Back to Top | |
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