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Mike Rosen
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   Posted 4/27/2016 12:11 PM (GMT -6)    Quote This PostAlert An Admin About This Post.
I know this has been discussed before, but I can't find it...

I have an auxiliary measure which starts with a tie from the previous, unshown measure. How do I get that backwards "half tie"?

I tried using an expression, but the closest thing I found was too thick.



Mike Rosen
www.specialmillwork.com

Bass with Choir of the Sound www.choirofthesound.org
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"As a musician, he's a damn fine woodworker."

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N. Grossingink
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   Posted 4/27/2016 12:36 PM (GMT -6)    Quote This PostAlert An Admin About This Post.
Try the "Edit Frame" box and check "Tie End".

I suspect you know how to get there, but for anyone interested:

√ Select Speedy Tool, click on note you want to edit
√ Press Escape, then Option/Click (Mac) on the same note
√ Edit Frame appears

N.


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Christopher Smith
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   Posted 4/27/2016 1:36 PM (GMT -6)    Quote This PostAlert An Admin About This Post.
N. Grossingink, that only worked on the first measure of a second ending. Does it work for ALL measures now?

I have had to create a normal tie, then drag it backwards with the Special Tool.


Christopher Smith

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Zuill
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   Posted 4/27/2016 1:42 PM (GMT -6)    Quote This PostAlert An Admin About This Post.
Backwards ties can also work if the measure is the first measure of a Coda, and the tie actually performs as it should. I believe it has to be a measure starting a system.

Zuill


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Mike Rosen
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   Posted 4/27/2016 1:44 PM (GMT -6)    Quote This PostAlert An Admin About This Post.
I went with Christopher's method. It isn't a coda, or repeat. It's a standalone system of three measures at the end, showing an optional key change.


Thanks, all!



Mike Rosen
www.specialmillwork.com

Bass with Choir of the Sound www.choirofthesound.org
Volunteer copyist (The Gang of Twelve) for the Barbershop Harmony Society
FINALE TIPS at www.specialmillwork.com/finale-tips-and-tricks/index.html

Finale 2014.5 on El Capitan
Simple Entry, QWERTY keyboard, numberpad. That's my system, and I'm stickin' to it.

"As a musician, he's a damn fine woodworker."

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N. Grossingink
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   Posted 4/27/2016 2:13 PM (GMT -6)    Quote This PostAlert An Admin About This Post.
Christopher Smith said...
N. Grossingink, that only worked on the first measure of a second ending. Does it work for ALL measures now?


No, that's not what I meant. Mike said:

I have an auxiliary measure which starts with a tie from the previous, unshown measure.

I was under the impression that this measure existed, but was hidden somehow. That wasn't the case, obviously.

N.


OSX 10.8.5
Finale 2011c, 2012c for production work
Finale 2014.5

TgTools, Patterson Plugins, JW Change and Staff Polyphony, QuicKeys 4
Mac Mini 2.4 Ghz Intel, 8GB RAM
New Belgium Fat Tire Ale

“The only reason for time is so that everything doesn't happen at once.”
–Albert Einstein

“And as you know, you don’t tell time–time tells you.”
–George Carlin

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Mike Rosen
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   Posted 4/27/2016 2:34 PM (GMT -6)    Quote This PostAlert An Admin About This Post.
Sorry I wasn't clear. In the score, which is about 90 measures, there is an optional key change in m. 54. My addendum shows mm 53, 54, and 55 rewritten to make the change (a half tone up bump), after which the singers should return to the score and sing to the end in the new key. I don't know if this is common in the real world; I've never seen it except in barbershop.



Mike Rosen
www.specialmillwork.com

Bass with Choir of the Sound www.choirofthesound.org
Volunteer copyist (The Gang of Twelve) for the Barbershop Harmony Society
FINALE TIPS at www.specialmillwork.com/finale-tips-and-tricks/index.html

Finale 2014.5 on El Capitan
Simple Entry, QWERTY keyboard, numberpad. That's my system, and I'm stickin' to it.

"As a musician, he's a damn fine woodworker."

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ttw
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   Posted 4/27/2016 2:41 PM (GMT -6)    Quote This PostAlert An Admin About This Post.
And I read the title as referring to men's formal dress.


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Zuill
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   Posted 4/27/2016 4:42 PM (GMT -6)    Quote This PostAlert An Admin About This Post.
The unattached tie is common on Looney Tunes cartoons.

Zuill

P.S.: This demo file has a reverse tie (tie end) created in the Speedy Edit Frame. When it occurs at the beginning of a system, it generally works.


"When all is said and done, more is said than done."
 
Win 7 64bit, 2011b, 2012c, 2014d, 2014.5 
 
Favorite Forum quote: "Please, everybody, IGNORE THE TROLL!"

Post Edited (Zuill) : 4/27/2016 4:45:29 PM (GMT-5)



File Attachment :
Tie End.musx   84KB (application/octet-stream)
This file has been downloaded 146 time(s).
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jim dukey
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   Posted 4/27/2016 4:45 PM (GMT -6)    Quote This PostAlert An Admin About This Post.
I thought "Option/=" gave reverse tie, maybe in Speedy.


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Zuill
"The Troll"



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   Posted 4/27/2016 4:47 PM (GMT -6)    Quote This PostAlert An Admin About This Post.
Ah. In Windows, in Simple Entry, Shift-T. In my example, I accomplished that in the measure starting a system.

Zuill

P.S.: I should mention that the previous system must not have anything in it in the same layer. If there is a need for music there, use a different layer. Another approach is to use a cutaway measure at the end of the prior system.


"When all is said and done, more is said than done."
 
Win 7 64bit, 2011b, 2012c, 2014d, 2014.5 
 
Favorite Forum quote: "Please, everybody, IGNORE THE TROLL!"

Post Edited (Zuill) : 4/27/2016 4:55:51 PM (GMT-5)

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Ward Baxter
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   Posted 5/2/2016 3:38 PM (GMT -6)    Quote This PostAlert An Admin About This Post.
Mike, we need to do this all the time in hymns with 3, 4, and even 5 endings which often don't follow nice little rules about where the measures appear in a given staff. What we generally do is create forward ties and manually adjust with the tie tool (under special tools). It is a hassle, but the appearance is what is desired and it is fairly stable once the layout has been pretty much locked in. The rule for backward ties (using OPT =) is the same as the Edit Frame box. In fact, I don't think the Edit Frame box allows you to do things you can't in the interface anymore (used to be able to pre-2005 at least). Zuill had a great tip a few years back that works great in many scenarios that may work for you:

forum.makemusic.com/default.aspx?f=6&m=296332
6/29/2010 Zuill said...

There are situations (as in an ending following a "skip ahead" command), that won't have an actual repeat sign, but you still might need the backwards tie. There is a trick: put the repeat sign there (this then shows the tie) and then create a staff style to hide the repeat. Works like a charm, and should playback correctly (no guarantees here).


Ward Baxter
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Mike Rosen
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   Posted 5/2/2016 5:36 PM (GMT -6)    Quote This PostAlert An Admin About This Post.
Good idea, Ward. I'll try it!



Mike Rosen
www.specialmillwork.com

Bass with Choir of the Sound www.choirofthesound.org
Volunteer copyist (The Gang of Twelve) for the Barbershop Harmony Society
FINALE TIPS at www.specialmillwork.com/finale-tips-and-tricks/index.html

Finale 2014.5 on El Capitan
Simple Entry, QWERTY keyboard, numberpad. That's my system, and I'm stickin' to it.

"As a musician, he's a damn fine woodworker."

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