The original version of this page can be found at : http://forum.makemusic.com/default.aspx?f=5&m=481931
Posted By : Motet - 8/2/2016 5:06 PM
Since my question is likely to be missed in the sticky thread, I'll ask again here: is the new Help Center intended to replace these forums?


Finale 2014.5, 2011b, 2005, TGTools
Windows 7, MIDI input
Finale Transposition Chart


Posted By : Ralph L. Bowers Jr. - 8/2/2016 9:17 PM
I already don't like how it requires dropbox or other for one to submit mus. or musx files for inspection. Not very conducive for easy viewing or rapid responses. Who ever at Make Music thinks this is acceptable......well, it's idiotic in the mildest of terms.



"We’re pleased to announce the release of a brand new help center! This platform includes new ways to discuss both the direction and use of our products:

Feature Requests - Have an idea for a new feature? Share it here and vote for others.

General Discussion - Ask questions to knowledgeable experts and share your expertise with others.

Our Customer Success team will be actively participating in our new help center - We hope to create a more transparent view into product development and foster helpful discussion related to the use of our products.

You’ll notice that there are some key differences between our user Communities and existing forums. Most notably,to attach .musx or other file types to a post you’ll need to create a shareable link using a cloud sharing service such as Dropbox or Google Drive. We look forward to hearing your feedback about our new platform and encourage you to tell us which features you’d like to see!"


Finale 2010b, 2011b, 2012c, 2014d, 2014.5 TGTools Pro, Patterson plugins, JW plugins (current for each Finale Instalation)
Sibelius 6.2, 7.1.3, 7.5.1, 8.4.1, Write Score Sound Sets, TMT Publisher Bundle Plugins, Bob Zawalich plugins, Dolet 6.6
Print Music 2004, 2010a, 2011a, 2014a
Progression, Progression 2, Progression 3, Notion 4, [Notion 5, (bought but not installed)update finally installed]
Pro Tools 9.5, Reaper
Kontakt 5
GPO4, GPO5, World Instruments
SmartScore X Pro, SmartScore X2 Pro, PhotoScore Ultimate 6 & 7 & 8.04 ( 7 has some utility----best of those available, 8 has some issues that need fixing)
M-Audio "Oxygen 25" Midi input keyboard (recent addition 2014)
Systems (5) // Windows XP Pro (32bit), [email protected] Windows 7 Pro, 8.1 Pro, Windows 10 64 bit, 4GB - 16GB RAM
Paper & Pencil

BMus, MM (Musicology)


Posted By : Motet - 8/2/2016 9:25 PM
My concern about that is that the sources of such attachments are unlikely to survive for very long, so the discussions won't be so useful for posterity.


Finale 2014.5, 2011b, 2005, TGTools
Windows 7, MIDI input
Finale Transposition Chart


Posted By : Zuill - 8/2/2016 10:08 PM
It looks like it is designed for questions to be directly answered by MakeMusic, as opposed to a user forum. If it is intended to replace the current forum, that would be interesting. Can anyone post, or does it require a login?

Zuill


"When all is said and done, more is said than done."
 
Win 7 64bit, 2011b, 2012c, 2014d, 2014.5 
 
Favorite Forum quote: "Please, everybody, IGNORE THE TROLL!"


Posted By : Motet - 8/3/2016 12:03 AM
Looks like you log in with your Finale customer info, like when you file a problem report.

I suspect you're right that it's a different thing. I like the Suggestion Box idea.


Finale 2014.5, 2011b, 2005, TGTools
Windows 7, MIDI input
Finale Transposition Chart


Posted By : Mike Rosen - 8/3/2016 8:59 AM
I don't like it, for reasons I posted in that thread.

On the other hand, a couple of questions were promptly and correctly answered by the MM rep.



Mike Rosen
www.specialmillwork.com

Bass with Choir of the Sound www.choirofthesound.org
Volunteer copyist (The Gang of Twelve) for the Barbershop Harmony Society
FINALE TIPS at www.specialmillwork.com/finale-tips-and-tricks/index.html

Finale 2014.5 on El Capitan
Simple Entry, QWERTY keyboard, numberpad. That's my system, and I'm stickin' to it.

"As a musician, he's a damn fine woodworker."


Posted By : Ron. - 8/3/2016 9:06 AM
I thought I'd try it out by posting a problem I have never gotten a satisfactory answer to.


Finale 2014.5

GPO5, JaBB3, GIO, COMB2, GWI, GIFF, Steinway Basic.

Windows 7; 10 GB RAM.

www.composeforums.com


Posted By : Motet - 8/3/2016 10:27 AM
Until this came along, there was *no* way to make a feature request, except via the laborious and private problem ticket. I agree having to put attachments elsewhere is less than ideal, but in fact it's easier to put something on Dropbox than upload it here, and presumably one can post an inline link to it.


Finale 2014.5, 2011b, 2005, TGTools
Windows 7, MIDI input
Finale Transposition Chart


Posted By : Mike Rosen - 8/3/2016 10:41 AM
One would also hope that this Help Center would not become the new first approach for people who simply haven't bothered to learn how to use the program.

If it deteriorates to a "how do I..." call center, I suspect that MM will quickly tire of it.



Mike Rosen
www.specialmillwork.com

Bass with Choir of the Sound www.choirofthesound.org
Volunteer copyist (The Gang of Twelve) for the Barbershop Harmony Society
FINALE TIPS at www.specialmillwork.com/finale-tips-and-tricks/index.html

Finale 2014.5 on El Capitan
Simple Entry, QWERTY keyboard, numberpad. That's my system, and I'm stickin' to it.

"As a musician, he's a damn fine woodworker."


Posted By : Dave Lang - 8/3/2016 11:56 AM
Somebody said...
We look forward to hearing your feedback about our new platform


companies should just quit posting things like that - it just pisses people off


MacBook Pro Retina 15" (late 2013), OSX 10.11.4, Finale 2014.5


Posted By : Zuill - 8/3/2016 5:07 PM
Yesterday MM was quick to respond to posts. Maybe today is a holiday?

Zuill


"When all is said and done, more is said than done."
 
Win 7 64bit, 2011b, 2012c, 2014d, 2014.5 
 
Favorite Forum quote: "Please, everybody, IGNORE THE TROLL!"


Posted By : Flint - 8/3/2016 8:06 PM
Zuill said...
Yesterday MM was quick to respond to posts. Maybe today is a holiday?


My friend Rose Nylund told me that is was St. Snrbnflrbl's day in her home town of St. Olaf, MN. Maybe they're keeping traditions from the old office location?


woodwind specialist and doubler - Finale 2014d using Speedy Entry - no capslock, GPO 4 Full, Garritan Jazz & Big Band 3, Garritan Concert and Marching Band 2, Windows 10, 12GB RAM, frequently RTFM.

If the composer says in effect to the performer: "I do not care whether you perform my music or not," we cannot argue the matter. But if he indicates: "I want you to perform and respond to this music," then his fundamental duty is to write his music so that it is accessible to interpretation. When the performer cannot approach the composer's meaning because of capriciously obscure notation, he may in effect say to the composer: "Why should I bother to puzzle out your music?" - Gardner Read
 


Posted By : Ron. - 8/3/2016 10:25 PM
Today is over and no new comments from MM on this new forum-thing. I guess it really is a holiday somewhere.


Finale 2014.5

GPO5, JaBB3, GIO, COMB2, GWI, GIFF, Steinway Basic.

Windows 7; 10 GB RAM.

www.composeforums.com


Posted By : Lawson D - 8/4/2016 10:31 AM
Hey Everyone,

I wanted to take a second to add some clarity to the purpose of the new community pages we've just rolled out, and answer some of the questions you have posted.

We believe it makes sense to consolidate your conversations and input for our products into one platform. While we won't be locking these existing forums immediately, we want to be transparent that the ultimate goal of our new communities is to replace this forum and focus your conversations within a single platform.

While this forum will eventually be locked, we know that there's a ton of valuable content here and we'll make sure that it's still accessible for reference well into the future.

The new community is not a public support portal - While we intend on maintaining an active voice in our community, the general discussion thread is just that, a place where our users can come together and discuss all things Finale. We'll step in and add clarity to discussions when needed, but we want our customers driving the conversation!

I'm happy to hear that the 'Feature Requests' portion of the community is a welcomed addition. We too hope that a public facing list of feature requests which can be voted upon by our customers will be a valuable addition to the Finale development process. The most popular requests will rise to the top with your input and help us determine the best direction for our software.

We know that the new community is a big change and we want to make sure this tool works for you. Please don't hesitate to let us know which features or functionality you'd like to see that would make your experience better.


Lawson D.
Notation/Garritan Product Specialist
MakeMusic, Inc



These on-line forums are intended for the exchange of ideas among the users of MakeMusic products. If you'd like individual help from our Customer Success staff, please contact us here.


Posted By : Motet - 8/4/2016 10:49 AM
I think you really need to provide uploads for examples, etc. Relying on users to place them elsewhere will result in broken links for someone wishing to go back and read an old thread. What's the issue, server space or software capability? If you have chosen software that doesn't provide that, now is the time to look for something else while there are not many posts there.


Finale 2014.5, 2011b, 2005, TGTools
Windows 7, MIDI input
Finale Transposition Chart

Post Edited (Motet) : 8/4/2016 10:52:33 AM (GMT-5)


Posted By : KennethKen - 8/4/2016 10:53 AM
Motet said...
I think you really need to provide uploads for examples, etc. Relying on users to place them elsewhere will result in broken links for someone wishing to go back and read an old thread. What's the issue, server space or software capability? If you have chosen software that doesn't provide that, now is the time to look for something else while there are not many posts there.


Absolutely!


 
Windows 7 Pro (64 bit), Finale 2014, Core i7 [email protected], 8GB Ram
Brass music, Woodwind Music, Concert Band Music, CDs, etc.


Posted By : Gareth Green - 8/4/2016 10:57 AM
KennethKen said...
Motet said...
I think you really need to provide uploads for examples, etc. Relying on users to place them elsewhere will result in broken links for someone wishing to go back and read an old thread. What's the issue, server space or software capability? If you have chosen software that doesn't provide that, now is the time to look for something else while there are not many posts there.


Absolutely!


Indeed; and maybe even something that allows uploads from IE ...


Gareth J. Green

Fin2014c
Windows 7


Posted By : Jetcopy - 8/4/2016 11:13 AM
Motet said...
I think you really need to provide uploads for examples, etc. Relying on users to place them elsewhere will result in broken links for someone wishing to go back and read an old thread. What's the issue, server space or software capability? If you have chosen software that doesn't provide that, now is the time to look for something else while there are not many posts there.

Agree 100%. I have no intention of using Dropbox or other method of file exchange. It needs to be a part of the forum software.


Retina Macbook Pro OSX 10.9.5, 2.5GHz Intel Core i7, 16 GB RAM, El Capitan on separate drive


Posted By : KennethKen - 8/4/2016 11:24 AM
Lawson D said...
Hey Everyone,

We too hope that a public facing list of feature requests which can be voted upon by our customers will be a valuable addition to the Finale development process. The most popular requests will rise to the top with your input and help us determine the best direction for our software.


I assume that up/down arrow counter on the left is the voting mechanism. That seems more clunky and much less conspicuous than the voting display on this forum. Is that normal? It doesn't say "cast your vote here" and allows for voting on individual comments (in addition to negative votes). Can't this kind of tabulation skew the data as not everyone will vote for the initial post but, inadvertently, just for a comment that they happen to read further down the thread? On the main board only the votes for the initial post are counted/shown even if dozens people vote next to a well worded comment within that thread.

Why would the new community board have less clarity on these functions than the current one? Such data presentation seems to undermines the efforts of those at MM who would seek to use it with any efficiency and misguide/misdirect users into a false impression of what is a popular idea (and possibly further skewing the data).


 
Windows 7 Pro (64 bit), Finale 2014, Core i7 [email protected], 8GB Ram
Brass music, Woodwind Music, Concert Band Music, CDs, etc.

Post Edited (KennethKen) : 8/4/2016 11:29:36 AM (GMT-5)


Posted By : Perotinus - 8/4/2016 11:38 AM
What's with the big obscuring window in front of the Help Center pages with "X STUFFFFFFFFFF...." written on it. Has this thing been hacked already?


Perotinus

Finale 2014.5
Windows 7 Enterprise 64-bit


Posted By : mm - 8/4/2016 11:54 AM
What are you supposed to be voting for? Why vote? Yes or no to what? The posters spelling? If it is a good question or not? This is idiotic. And if this is the famous suggestion opportunity, it's laughable. There needs to be a clearly spelled out method to suggest an improvement or report something that doesn't work. And having to use DropBox or the like to upload examples relating to a problem will be discouraging people to use this "Forum."
JetCopy said...
It needs to be a part of the forum software
Exactly!


Finale 3.7 - 2014.5, GPO4.02/5, Cubase, ProTools, ASUS laptop, Intel Core i5, 8GB RAM, WIN 8.1 (64-bit), 18.4'' display, M-Audio Keystation 49 + Mini 32 keyboards


Posted By : Jolora - 8/4/2016 11:56 AM
Please, please, please, please, PLEASE, PLEASE, PLEASE, PLEASE fix the Help Center UI color scheme.

It was a very poor decision to use grey text color on a white background, or similarly a slightly darker text with a lighter shade of the same color background.

IT IS TERRIBLE FOR PEOPLE WITH EVEN SLIGHT VISION PROBLEMS!

Please, please, please, please, PLEASE, PLEASE, PLEASE, PLEASE fix the Help Center UI color scheme.

MM should hire a Human Factors consultant toreview your UI designs for readability and ADA compliance.


Joe

Finale v1 through 2014.5
JW Plugins; TG Tools (Full)
Garritan GPO 4; GPO 5; Garritan COMB 2; Garritan JABB 3
Anvil Studio 2015 midi editor

Windows 10 64-bit, Intel i7-4771, 32GB RAM, 500GB SSD (C Drive)


Posted By : Malcolm M. - 8/4/2016 12:01 PM
Hi all, I'd like to address some important concerns brought up by Motet and others about uploading files to Community posts. The answer is a bit complicated.

As some of you may have noticed, the Help Center (which includes the knowledge base, Communities, and submitting tickets for support) is a Zendesk based platform, and the ability to upload files to posts is limited by that platform. It's possible that Zendesk may make changes to the platform to allow this feature and I know from helping to build out this platform myself that it's a very common request (see this post as an example) that we hope will be realized in the future.

For some of you this may beg the question: why adopt the platform at all with these limitations? To echo sentiments from Mark Adler's blog post, we're also looking to remove technical debt from platforms that we've historically been relying on (including this forum‒sadly to say), and to consolidate our support resources into one place. Consolidating resources using Zendesk lets us create and maintain accurate and up-to-date content for support, and to provide a place for active and open discussion between the community and MakeMusic.

This phrase may be thrown around a lot, but we greatly appreciate your feedback and plan to use that feedback to drive change. We know the current platform isn't perfect, but certainly hope you'll join us in the new discussion.


Malcolm M.
Customer Success Manager
MakeMusic, Inc.


These online forums are intended for the exchange of ideas among the users of MakeMusic products. If you'd like individual help from our technical support staff, please contact us directly at www.finalemusic.com/support/contact-us/.


Posted By : Ralph L. Bowers Jr. - 8/4/2016 1:12 PM
Malcolm M. said...
Hi all, I'd like to address some important concerns brought up by Motet and others about uploading files to Community posts. The answer is a bit complicated.

As some of you may have noticed, the Help Center (which includes the knowledge base, Communities, and submitting tickets for support) is a Zendesk based platform, and the ability to upload files to posts is limited by that platform. It's possible that Zendesk may make changes to the platform to allow this feature and I know from helping to build out this platform myself that it's a very common request (see this post as an example) that we hope will be realized in the future.

For some of you this may beg the question: why adopt the platform at all with these limitations? To echo sentiments from Mark Adler's blog post, we're also looking to remove technical debt from platforms that we've historically been relying on (including this forum‒sadly to say), and to consolidate our support resources into one place. Consolidating resources using Zendesk lets us create and maintain accurate and up-to-date content for support, and to provide a place for active and open discussion between the community and MakeMusic.

This phrase may be thrown around a lot, but we greatly appreciate your feedback and plan to use that feedback to drive change. We know the current platform isn't perfect, but certainly hope you'll join us in the new discussion.


As I am sure you know, help from the user base for products, especially software is a great benefit not only for the end user but the software company itself.
And, I don't need to go into those here but suffice it to say ease of posting files for others to view and trouble shoot is what we need.


Finale 2010b, 2011b, 2012c, 2014d, 2014.5 TGTools Pro, Patterson plugins, JW plugins (current for each Finale Instalation)
Sibelius 6.2, 7.1.3, 7.5.1, 8.4.1, Write Score Sound Sets, TMT Publisher Bundle Plugins, Bob Zawalich plugins, Dolet 6.6
Print Music 2004, 2010a, 2011a, 2014a
Progression, Progression 2, Progression 3, Notion 4, [Notion 5, (bought but not installed)update finally installed]
Pro Tools 9.5, Reaper
Kontakt 5
GPO4, GPO5, World Instruments
SmartScore X Pro, SmartScore X2 Pro, PhotoScore Ultimate 6 & 7 & 8.04 ( 7 has some utility----best of those available, 8 has some issues that need fixing)
M-Audio "Oxygen 25" Midi input keyboard (recent addition 2014)
Systems (5) // Windows XP Pro (32bit), [email protected] Windows 7 Pro, 8.1 Pro, Windows 10 64 bit, 4GB - 16GB RAM
Paper & Pencil

BMus, MM (Musicology)


Posted By : Ralph L. Bowers Jr. - 8/4/2016 2:05 PM
Besides MM posting on this forum about the new portals why have they not posted on the only other site that will get a broader viewing with comments (the Facebook page) or even done a blog report.

Not being able to easily post files is an IDIOTIC idea.


Finale 2010b, 2011b, 2012c, 2014d, 2014.5 TGTools Pro, Patterson plugins, JW plugins (current for each Finale Instalation)
Sibelius 6.2, 7.1.3, 7.5.1, 8.4.1, Write Score Sound Sets, TMT Publisher Bundle Plugins, Bob Zawalich plugins, Dolet 6.6
Print Music 2004, 2010a, 2011a, 2014a
Progression, Progression 2, Progression 3, Notion 4, [Notion 5, (bought but not installed)update finally installed]
Pro Tools 9.5, Reaper
Kontakt 5
GPO4, GPO5, World Instruments
SmartScore X Pro, SmartScore X2 Pro, PhotoScore Ultimate 6 & 7 & 8.04 ( 7 has some utility----best of those available, 8 has some issues that need fixing)
M-Audio "Oxygen 25" Midi input keyboard (recent addition 2014)
Systems (5) // Windows XP Pro (32bit), [email protected] Windows 7 Pro, 8.1 Pro, Windows 10 64 bit, 4GB - 16GB RAM
Paper & Pencil

BMus, MM (Musicology)


Posted By : Jetcopy - 8/4/2016 2:08 PM
I don't know diddly about the technical aspect of any of this, but suffice to say that there are hundreds of user forums in existence right now that allow the uploading and posting of:
files
images
youtube videos
soundcloud and other audio formats.
etc....

While I appreciate Malcolm's input and description of the problem, it seems logical to me that whatever type of forum or customer portal is to be put in place in the future, it should offer more options than we currently have, not less.

JT


Retina Macbook Pro OSX 10.9.5, 2.5GHz Intel Core i7, 16 GB RAM, El Capitan on separate drive


Posted By : KennethKen - 8/4/2016 3:12 PM
Ralph L. Bowers Jr. said...
...suffice it to say ease of posting files for others to view and trouble shoot is what we need.


This is especially important if MM's customer support is going to continue to direct users to these community boards for help with certain problems (as they have done historically with the forum). Now, not only does the user with the problem have to use a 3rd party account but the users who might have offered to help have to visit those sites. Are only trusted links going to be allowed? I don't know what they use in other countries other than Dropbox and Google and am a bit concerned about going to an unfamiliar web address just to see a jpeg of someone's problem. This would be my initial concern and feedback.

Then there's the structure-less solicitation of feature requests and votes that won't be conducive to quick comprehension, analysis or transparency. That's my 2nd concern.

Heck, I don't even know if the feedback for the Community Help Center should be submitted to the Feature Request board there or on these forums?


 
Windows 7 Pro (64 bit), Finale 2014, Core i7 [email protected], 8GB Ram
Brass music, Woodwind Music, Concert Band Music, CDs, etc.

Post Edited (KennethKen) : 8/4/2016 3:15:07 PM (GMT-5)


Posted By : Ron. - 8/4/2016 3:27 PM
Jetcopy said...
I don't know diddly about the technical aspect of any of this, but suffice to say that there are hundreds of user forums in existence right now that allow the uploading and posting of:
files
images
youtube videos
soundcloud and other audio formats.
etc....

While I appreciate Malcolm's input and description of the problem, it seems logical to me that whatever type of forum or customer portal is to be put in place in the future, it should offer more options than we currently have, not less.

JT


Including out little www.composeforums.com--which is powered by a shareware program of which I considered dozens (all allow uploads) before settling on Simple Machines. Actually to write code from scratch for a forum is not that big a deal. No reason that MM couldn't write their own.


Finale 2014.5

GPO5, JaBB3, GIO, COMB2, GWI, GIFF, Steinway Basic.

Windows 7; 10 GB RAM.

www.composeforums.com


Posted By : Mike Rosen - 8/4/2016 3:54 PM
Well, so far the vote against the new paradigm seems to be US: many, MM: none.

I said it in another thread, and I'll say it again, here: Stop mucking about with all the flashy social media stuff, get real (Customer Success Agents? Oh, please...) and work on giving us a product that works well for everyone.

Improvements are good, but how about fixing long term bugs and addressing requests that WE make, rather than deciding in your focus groups/ouiji boards what we want?



Mike Rosen
www.specialmillwork.com

Bass with Choir of the Sound www.choirofthesound.org
Volunteer copyist (The Gang of Twelve) for the Barbershop Harmony Society
FINALE TIPS at www.specialmillwork.com/finale-tips-and-tricks/index.html

Finale 2014.5 on El Capitan
Simple Entry, QWERTY keyboard, numberpad. That's my system, and I'm stickin' to it.

"As a musician, he's a damn fine woodworker."


Posted By : Motet - 8/4/2016 5:07 PM
Ron. said...
Actually to write code from scratch for a forum is not that big a deal. No reason that MM couldn't write their own.

As someone who used to develop and sell forums software (albeit with more features than are discussed here), I think you underestimate the problem. In any case, no reason for MM to spend their time on that. (What you have at composeforums seems fine, but sounds like Zendesk provides more than just the forums.)

Malcolm, could the company at least provide a separate place to upload files? It my not be as convenient as something integrated into Zendesk, but at least that would guarantee that links would not break at a later date.


Finale 2014.5, 2011b, 2005, TGTools
Windows 7, MIDI input
Finale Transposition Chart


Posted By : Malcolm M. - 8/4/2016 6:09 PM
Thanks again for all of your suggestions and discussion about the new Help Center. We realize that sharing files for meaningful discussion is really important for you all, and in the spirit of transparency we'll be looking into additional options for sharing files within Zendesk. One caveat, though: I couldn't‒in good conscience‒make any specific promises of what, or when, or if that'll become a reality. Keep your fingers crossed though, because we're certainly doing the same and hope to be able to bring you good news.


Malcolm M.
Customer Success Manager
MakeMusic, Inc.


These online forums are intended for the exchange of ideas among the users of MakeMusic products. If you'd like individual help from our technical support staff, please contact us directly at www.finalemusic.com/support/contact-us/.


Posted By : johnmouse - 8/5/2016 6:00 AM
With its limitations, I'm afraid Zendesk will never find nirvana. I realize MM is trying to save money, but improper support (remember that phrase "customer support?") can backfire.


John

Finale 2012/2014 (Well, it's installed.)
M-Audio KeyRig 49
Desktop: Windows 8.1/i5 Core/8 Gig RAM
Laptop: Windows 7/i3 Core/6 Gig RAM


Posted By : Ron. - 8/5/2016 7:34 AM
This brand new "help" centre doesn't appear to work any better than the out-dated methods: i.e., posting here or opening a problem ticket, judging by the non-responses from MM staff to posted problems. So, what's the point?


Finale 2014.5

GPO5, JaBB3, GIO, COMB2, GWI, GIFF, Steinway Basic.

Windows 7; 10 GB RAM.

www.composeforums.com


Posted By : gogreen - 8/5/2016 7:40 AM
Count me in on agreeing that the new forum needs its own upload option. I am a member and participant in some 31 Internet forums on a wide range of topics. Very few of them require uploads to different sites, and I post far more in those sites that allow uploads than I do in sites that require third-party sites for uploading images and files.

What about the Garritan forum? Does the new forum include Garritan questions, or will Garritan get its own forum? What about MM's current Garritan forum?


Arthur J. Michaels

/www.facebook.com/composerarthurjmichaels

Finale 2000, 2001, 2003, 2005, 2006, 2007, 2011b.r2, 2014d, 2014.5 (currently using 2014.5)
Core i7 860 @ 2.80 GHz, 8.0 GB RAM, Windows 10 Home x64
Garritan COMB2, GPO4, GPO5, Aria Player 1.860, Audacity 2.1.2
Dell 2408 WFP, 1920x1200
M-Audio Delta Audiophile 2496
Casio WK-3000
M-Audio AV40 monitors
AKG K-240 Studio headphones
Brother MFC-L2740DW printer


Posted By : michelp - 8/5/2016 8:48 AM
There seem to be 3 separate forums (or is it one, which sorts the contents by topic ?), and Garritan has its own. Follow Support -> Ask a Question, and click on the black rectangle "Garritan" to see "Ask the Community".
Update : that page has now disappeared.
The whole navigation, buttons, etc... is really obscure and needs more logic and more clarity in the terms used
On the main screen, for instance : Community leads to a screen which only has Finale-related links. If you click on "Finale Forum", surprize, you see Finale, Garritan, SmartMusic.
And a "new post" button, before one selects the forum !
A labyrinth !

P.S. : Another button is "Finale Blog : Join the conversation at our blog" (...where dialogue has been closed down for a while).


Michel
Finale 2014.5, 2014d, 2012c (main), 2011c, 2010b, 2009b, MacOsX 10.9.5, Mac Mini Intel Core i7 2,7 Ghz, 16 Go Ram, French azerty kb, Dolet 6. Full TGTools. MOTU Audio Express, 3 monitors.

Post Edited (michelp) : 8/5/2016 9:18:31 AM (GMT-5)


Posted By : Zuill - 8/5/2016 10:06 AM
I still think having separate for a for Win, Mac, etc. is better as when a question is asked, we usually know the basic category of the operating system.

With the new help center, is it required to give necessary specs, or are we still guessing?

Zuill


"When all is said and done, more is said than done."
 
Win 7 64bit, 2011b, 2012c, 2014d, 2014.5 
 
Favorite Forum quote: "Please, everybody, IGNORE THE TROLL!"


Posted By : Mike Rosen - 8/5/2016 11:04 AM
The other Finale forum has a spot to add your system and version right in your ID pane.



Mike Rosen
www.specialmillwork.com

Bass with Choir of the Sound www.choirofthesound.org
Volunteer copyist (The Gang of Twelve) for the Barbershop Harmony Society
FINALE TIPS at www.specialmillwork.com/finale-tips-and-tricks/index.html

Finale 2014.5 on El Capitan
Simple Entry, QWERTY keyboard, numberpad. That's my system, and I'm stickin' to it.

"As a musician, he's a damn fine woodworker."


Posted By : Dave Lang - 8/5/2016 12:02 PM
"Your opinion" is just a check box on a project plan. It has no impact on what is eventually delivered. Welcome to late stage capitalism.

I predict nothing is going to change as a result of the opinions expressed here.

Is it late summer yet or what?


MacBook Pro Retina 15" (late 2013), OSX 10.11.4, Finale 2014.5


Posted By : Perotinus - 8/5/2016 4:05 PM
Yes, until the autumn equinox.


Perotinus

Finale 2014.5
Windows 7 Enterprise 64-bit


Posted By : Motet - 8/5/2016 7:01 PM
KennethKen said...

I assume that up/down arrow counter on the left is the voting mechanism.

I think it's a "Like" button.

Mike Rosen said...
If it deteriorates to a "how do I..." call center, I suspect that MM will quickly tire of it.


Today's feature request: "How do you create a triplet consisting of a quarter note, then a half note (to cover a duration of two quarter notes)?"


Finale 2014.5, 2011b, 2005, TGTools
Windows 7, MIDI input
Finale Transposition Chart

Post Edited (Motet) : 8/5/2016 7:10:10 PM (GMT-5)


Posted By : Perotinus - 8/5/2016 9:42 PM
Q.E.D. (on the last statement of the prior post). Cf. also post of yesterday, 4:12, 3rd paragraph.


Perotinus

Finale 2014.5
Windows 7 Enterprise 64-bit

Post Edited (Perotinus) : 8/5/2016 9:52:00 PM (GMT-5)


Posted By : HaraldS - 8/8/2016 1:46 PM
Motet said...
Today's feature request: "How do you create a triplet consisting of a quarter note, then a half note (to cover a duration of two quarter notes)?"


Yes, that's definitely misplaced. But you'll never have a new forum in which everyone understands the structure instantly and uses it correctly. I used to be a moderator (one of more than 40) in germany's largest music forum for 4 years and had all sorts of misplaced questions to be moved to the correct area. A forum's attractivity and readability depends on the positive attitude of its users and the staff's (admin, moderators) activity. Let's see how that turns out for the new help centre.

In general, I'm glad that at least something is happening forum-wise...this outdated dotNetBB forum software is a shame for a company producing a professional notation program like Finale. Fellow user OCTO shows with a simple phpBB default-theme installation and personal involvement how to run music notation forum with highly interesting discussions.

Harald


Finale 3.0-2014.5, german edition, Windows 7
lots of hardware synths/keys, Cubase 7 / trombonist, pianist, conductor / Recklinghausen, Germany


Posted By : gogreen - 8/10/2016 8:12 AM
HaraldS said...
Fellow user OCTO shows with a simple phpBB default-theme installation and personal involvement how to run music notation forum with highly interesting discussions.

I agree. I can't think of any other forum of which I'm a member that doesn't divide its topics into discussion areas. At least Mac and Windows divisions would be helpful (Zuill suggested that earlier), and the Feature Requests item can also be incorporated into the MM Community Forum. It would also be helpful and save much time to see a user's operating system and Finale libraries as part of the user's ID at a glance. Still, a new forum with up-to-date software is a step in the right direction.


Arthur J. Michaels

/www.facebook.com/composerarthurjmichaels

Finale 2000, 2001, 2003, 2005, 2006, 2007, 2011b.r2, 2014d, 2014.5 (currently using 2014.5)
Core i7 860 @ 2.80 GHz, 8.0 GB RAM, Windows 10 Home x64
Garritan COMB2, GPO4, GPO5, Aria Player 1.860, Audacity 2.1.2
Dell 2408 WFP, 1920x1200
M-Audio Delta Audiophile 2496
Casio WK-3000
M-Audio AV40 monitors
AKG K-240 Studio headphones
Brother MFC-L2740DW printer


Posted By : Ralph L. Bowers Jr. - 8/10/2016 9:25 AM
Best to Worst:
I'd rather have a Lexus as opposed to a Fiat.
What they have given us at present with this new user forum is a Fiat which of course is one step up from a Yugo so I guess all is well with the world.


Finale 2010b, 2011b, 2012c, 2014d, 2014.5 TGTools Pro, Patterson plugins, JW plugins (current for each Finale Instalation)
Sibelius 6.2, 7.1.3, 7.5.1, 8.4.1, Write Score Sound Sets, TMT Publisher Bundle Plugins, Bob Zawalich plugins, Dolet 6.6
Print Music 2004, 2010a, 2011a, 2014a
Progression, Progression 2, Progression 3, Notion 4, [Notion 5, (bought but not installed)update finally installed]
Pro Tools 9.5, Reaper
Kontakt 5
GPO4, GPO5, World Instruments
SmartScore X Pro, SmartScore X2 Pro, PhotoScore Ultimate 6 & 7 & 8.04 ( 7 has some utility----best of those available, 8 has some issues that need fixing)
M-Audio "Oxygen 25" Midi input keyboard (recent addition 2014)
Systems (5) // Windows XP Pro (32bit), [email protected] Windows 7 Pro, 8.1 Pro, Windows 10 64 bit, 4GB - 16GB RAM
Paper & Pencil

BMus, MM (Musicology)


Posted By : Mike Rosen - 8/10/2016 10:21 AM
If they decide to split it into subforums, I would suggest Notation and Playback as a good split.



Mike Rosen
www.specialmillwork.com

Bass with Choir of the Sound www.choirofthesound.org
Volunteer copyist (The Gang of Twelve) for the Barbershop Harmony Society
FINALE TIPS at www.specialmillwork.com/finale-tips-and-tricks/index.html

Finale 2014.5 on El Capitan
Simple Entry, QWERTY keyboard, numberpad. That's my system, and I'm stickin' to it.

"As a musician, he's a damn fine woodworker."


Posted By : Derrek - 8/10/2016 11:56 AM
I just want to see when I open the contents screen:
1. Which threads have I not yet read
2. Which threads have new comments added (with a shortcut button to those messages on each thread)
3. A vertically more compressed listing so I can see more threads per page

The pre-release Dorico Board at Steinberg has all of these things. Surely Steinberg isn't using archaic software. I generally find messages that question MM's supposed thinking distasteful, but these new BBS formats--and stripping comments from their blog pages--seems to be putting MM's convenience ahead of users', a bad sign.

PLEASE, MM, rethink these changes, especially this choice of BBS software.


Finale 2014d - Windows 7
GPO 4, JABB 3, World Instruments
TG Tools Full, (Sonar Platinum)

“Outside of a dog, a book is a man’s best friend. Inside of a dog it’s too dark to read.” — Groucho Marx


Posted By : Motet - 8/10/2016 12:39 PM
It is not very usable, and the fact that they chose this is worrisome.

I know they are busy with the impending next version, but it doesn't look like MM has participated at all in the Help Center except for a (possibly staged?) exchange the first day. I think I'll put my efforts here instead for now.


Finale 2014.5, 2011b, 2005, TGTools
Windows 7, MIDI input
Finale Transposition Chart


Posted By : Mike Rosen - 8/10/2016 3:15 PM
I agree. I don't have the time to go to other forums (or FaceBook, or Twitter.)

If it's not here, I guess I'll have to miss it.



Mike Rosen
www.specialmillwork.com

Bass with Choir of the Sound www.choirofthesound.org
Volunteer copyist (The Gang of Twelve) for the Barbershop Harmony Society
FINALE TIPS at www.specialmillwork.com/finale-tips-and-tricks/index.html

Finale 2014.5 on El Capitan
Simple Entry, QWERTY keyboard, numberpad. That's my system, and I'm stickin' to it.

"As a musician, he's a damn fine woodworker."


Posted By : N. Grossingink - 8/15/2016 10:05 AM
I'm wondering…

Is there any interest at all among the active members of this forum in following or participating in these new forums? I see just a handful of familiar names popping up.

And sadly, there are many, many questions that have been left unanswered. Including Ron Brown, who has been waiting for more than a week now.

N.


OSX Mavericks 10.9.5
Finale 2011c, 2012c for production work

OSX El Capitan 10.11.6
Finale 2014.5

TgTools, Patterson Plugins, JW Change and Staff Polyphony, QuicKeys 4
Mac Mini 2.4 Ghz Intel, 8GB RAM
New Belgium Fat Tire Ale


Posted By : Mike Rosen - 8/15/2016 10:14 AM
I've been over there once or twice, mostly out of boredom.



Mike Rosen
www.specialmillwork.com

Bass with Choir of the Sound www.choirofthesound.org
Volunteer copyist (The Gang of Twelve) for the Barbershop Harmony Society
FINALE TIPS at www.specialmillwork.com/finale-tips-and-tricks/index.html

Finale 2014.5 on El Capitan
Simple Entry, QWERTY keyboard, numberpad. That's my system, and I'm stickin' to it.

"As a musician, he's a damn fine woodworker."


Posted By : Daz - 8/15/2016 11:01 AM
Hi

I've been there as well.
Unfortunately, I just cannot get past the UI.
That, and the fact that I cannot post example pics, scores etc. I don't have access to any cloud service. (it's a choice thing.)

Once I'm able to get some profile issues sorted out, I'll spend more time there.
But at the moment I'm hoping that MM might improve the forum a bit.

Cheers..


Daz. :o)

------------------------
Finale 2006-2011 - Win7 64 bit


Posted By : Ron. - 8/15/2016 11:40 AM
It appears to be another user-run forum where MM staff sit back and let the users do all the slogging. Many posters do not get the concept of "feature request" and are using it to post their problems and difficulties and no one from MM is intervening.

If it is meant to be a replacement for this forum, it is a very poor replacement. If it is meant to be something else, then MM ought to take a more active role--in MHO.


Finale 2014.5

GPO5, JaBB3, GIO, COMB2, GWI, GIFF, Steinway Basic.

Windows 7; 10 GB RAM.

www.composeforums.com


Posted By : Motet - 8/15/2016 11:50 AM
Besides not being able to leave atttachments, Derrek's comment bears repeating:

Derrek said...
I just want to see when I open the contents screen:
1. Which threads have I not yet read
2. Which threads have new comments added (with a shortcut button to those messages on each thread)
3. A vertically more compressed listing so I can see more threads per page


Without those things, it's not very usable.


Finale 2014.5, 2011b, 2005, TGTools
Windows 7, MIDI input
Finale Transposition Chart


Posted By : Derrek - 8/15/2016 5:33 PM
Daz said...
...That, and the fact that I cannot post example pics, scores etc. ...
You can leave pictures. Not that this makes the new forum usable, but I want to be fair.


Finale 2014d - Windows 7
GPO 4, JABB 3, World Instruments
TG Tools Full, (Sonar Platinum)

“Outside of a dog, a book is a man’s best friend. Inside of a dog it’s too dark to read.” — Groucho Marx


Posted By : Ron. - 8/16/2016 8:27 PM
If I interpreted a remark from an MM staff member who responded to a posting made in the new unimproved "Community" forum, it is meant to be user-driven--in other words, a replacement for this forum. Too bad that this ancient outmoded piece of software here is more flexible than the new modern one. The more we "progress" the less we have, it seems.


Finale 2014.5

GPO5, JaBB3, GIO, COMB2, GWI, GIFF, Steinway Basic.

Windows 7; 10 GB RAM.

www.composeforums.com


Posted By : Motet - 8/16/2016 8:53 PM
They said as much in this topic. I don't think I will participate. Anything that doesn't remember what you've already seen is not workable, I don't think.


Finale 2014.5, 2011b, 2005, TGTools
Windows 7, MIDI input
Finale Transposition Chart


Posted By : ttw - 8/16/2016 9:12 PM
There are no upgrades, only changes.


Finale 2014.5
GWI, GPO4, GPO5, JABB 3, Steinway Basic, COMB2

Windows 10 Pro HP Envy Desktop
Windows 10 Home HP Portable


Posted By : Ron. - 8/17/2016 6:34 AM
In the modest forum that Michel & I run, we periodically ban certain IP addresses and it has never impacted the rest of the community. Users can also post attachments, create auto signatures, receive email notifications, "like" and "unlike" posts, quote each other's posts, admin can organize topics, etc--all the things one would expect on a forum.

In other words, I am very, very discouraged by MM's decision to replace this forum with one that can do none of those things. We're amateurs and can do it--they are supposed to be professionals.

From my experience so far--the new forum is next to useless and I will not be using it.


Finale 2014.5

GPO5, JaBB3, GIO, COMB2, GWI, GIFF, Steinway Basic.

Windows 7; 10 GB RAM.

www.composeforums.com


Posted By : Motet - 8/17/2016 11:08 AM
It apparently automatically subscribes you to email notifications in a thread you post in, which I don't want.


Finale 2014.5, 2011b, 2005, TGTools
Windows 7, MIDI input
Finale Transposition Chart


Posted By : Derrek - 8/17/2016 11:43 AM
Motet said...
It apparently automatically subscribes you to email notifications in a thread you post in, which I don't want.
Ditto! It is not the same as having the status of read and unread posts on the forum content page itself.
I wish they could use the software Steinberg is using for the Dorico [pre-release] board.


Finale 2014d - Windows 7
GPO 4, JABB 3, World Instruments
TG Tools Full, (Sonar Platinum)

“Outside of a dog, a book is a man’s best friend. Inside of a dog it’s too dark to read.” — Groucho Marx


Posted By : Motet - 8/17/2016 11:47 AM
After about a dozen "My IP's been blocked" emails, I noticed the Unsubscribe button at the bottom of one of them. If you click this, it mysteriously takes you to the posting, but says "you've been unsubscribed" at the top. It's easy to miss. If it were an active forum like this one, I don't think that after a visit I'd want half a dozen emails to unsubscribe to.

The title page also shows when the thread was started (in "days" or "hours ago") rather than when it was last posted to.


Finale 2014.5, 2011b, 2005, TGTools
Windows 7, MIDI input
Finale Transposition Chart

Post Edited (Motet) : 8/17/2016 11:52:24 AM (GMT-5)


Posted By : bpalm - 8/17/2016 2:20 PM
Motet said...
It apparently automatically subscribes you to email notifications in a thread you post in, which I don't want.


I don't want either!

Posted By : Derrek - 8/18/2016 5:24 PM
Although this forum is still active (so far) the new help center has apparently meant the end of the "Ask A Question" support on the MakeMusic web site. THAT is a profoundly unhelpful change, especially when MM Support so seldom responds on the new help center.

As Jane Austen would say: "Badly done!"

EDIT: I have since learned that a link at the top of the Contents screen, "Submit a request," leads to a new way to submit a question to MM.


Finale 2014d - Windows 7
GPO 4, JABB 3, World Instruments
TG Tools Full, (Sonar Platinum)

“Outside of a dog, a book is a man’s best friend. Inside of a dog it’s too dark to read.” — Groucho Marx

Post Edited (Derrek) : 8/20/2016 9:35:27 AM (GMT-5)


Posted By : HaraldS - 8/20/2016 4:28 AM
Although the general idea of the feature request forum is a good one, it's pretty useless if it gets cluttered up by off-topic questions. Many users don't seem to understand its purpose.

I'm not sure if MM understands that if a forum has a specific target (which they even wrote down in the "Feature request house roules"), you can't leave a forum alone and hope everything goes well. You have to take care and delete off-topic questions, otherwise the forum's target won't be reached. Here in the old forums, we don't have that problem, the old forums aren't dedicated to such a specific aim.

Harald


Finale 3.0-2014.5, german edition, Windows 7
lots of hardware synths/keys, Cubase 7 / trombonist, pianist, conductor / Recklinghausen, Germany


Posted By : KennethKen - 8/20/2016 2:40 PM

There should also be more guidance for people posting to such at specific board.  Instead of having a big text box titled "Details", there shold be multiple text boxes with very direct titles. For example:

  1. "What is it that you want to do in Finale?"
  2. "What is the biggest challenge to achieving this goal in Finale?"
  3. "Do you have any recommendations for how we can make your goal easier to achieve in Finale? Be as specific as you like."
  4. "In what way will this added functionality/help you or others?

Even with these 4 simple questions (the first 3 should be mandatory) it will be much easier for MM and other forum users to sift through and understand each feature request. Novice users are less likely to post "How-do-I-add-a-measure" questions since the titles will remind them that this board is for user feedback (not MM feedback). And even if a novice does post an inappropriate question everyone who reads the first line (e.g., I want to transpose a horn part.") will know that it's probably a mis-categorized post.

Ken



 
Windows 7 Pro (64 bit), Finale 2014, Core i7 [email protected], 8GB Ram
Brass music, Woodwind Music, Concert Band Music, CDs, etc.

Post Edited (KennethKen) : 8/20/2016 9:18:53 PM (GMT-5)


Posted By : Flint - 8/20/2016 6:18 PM
KennethKen said...
There should also be more guidance for people posting to such at specific board. Instead of having a big text box titled "Details", there shold be multiple text boxes with very direct titles. For example:

<OL>
* "What is it that you want to do in Finale?"

* "What is the biggest challenge to achieving this goal in Finale?"

* "Do you have any recommendations for how we can make your goal easier to achieve in Finale? Be as specific as you like."

* "In what way will this added functionality help you or others?
</OL>
Even with these 4 simple questions (the first 3 should be mandatory) it will be much easier for MM and other forum users to sift through and understand each feature request. Novice users are less likely to post "How-do-I-add-a-measure" questions since the titles will remind them that this board is for user feedback (not MM feedback). And even if a novice does post an inappropriate question everyone who reads the first line (e.g., I want to transpose a horn part.") will know that it's probably a mis-categorized post.


I like the idea, but history shows us that making things idiot-proof just makes idiots find something else to idiot-up.


woodwind specialist and doubler - Finale 2014d using Speedy Entry - no capslock, GPO 4 Full, Garritan Jazz & Big Band 3, Garritan Concert and Marching Band 2, Windows 10, 12GB RAM, frequently RTFM.

If the composer says in effect to the performer: "I do not care whether you perform my music or not," we cannot argue the matter. But if he indicates: "I want you to perform and respond to this music," then his fundamental duty is to write his music so that it is accessible to interpretation. When the performer cannot approach the composer's meaning because of capriciously obscure notation, he may in effect say to the composer: "Why should I bother to puzzle out your music?" - Gardner Read
 


Posted By : Ron. - 8/20/2016 6:27 PM
If all the experienced users who have kept this forum going for so long boycott the new one until basic issues that we have brought up are addressed then maybe, just maybe, someone will pay attention.


Finale 2014.5

GPO5, JaBB3, GIO, COMB2, GWI, GIFF, Steinway Basic.

Windows 7; 10 GB RAM.

www.composeforums.com


Posted By : Ralph L. Bowers Jr. - 8/20/2016 6:52 PM
Ron. said...
If all the experienced users who have kept this forum going for so long boycott the new one until basic issues that we have brought up are addressed then maybe, just maybe, someone will pay attention.


I hopeful that those in charge understand how helpful to MakeMusic that this user forum really is.
But, maybe we will see a slow death from ignorance.


Finale 2010b, 2011b, 2012c, 2014d, 2014.5 TGTools Pro, Patterson plugins, JW plugins (current for each Finale Instalation)
Sibelius 6.2, 7.1.3, 7.5.1, 8.4.1, Write Score Sound Sets, TMT Publisher Bundle Plugins, Bob Zawalich plugins, Dolet 6.6
Print Music 2004, 2010a, 2011a, 2014a
Progression, Progression 2, Progression 3, Notion 4, [Notion 5, (bought but not installed)update finally installed]
Pro Tools 9.5, Reaper
Kontakt 5
GPO4, GPO5, World Instruments
SmartScore X Pro, SmartScore X2 Pro, PhotoScore Ultimate 6 & 7 & 8.04 ( 7 has some utility----best of those available, 8 has some issues that need fixing)
M-Audio "Oxygen 25" Midi input keyboard (recent addition 2014)
Systems (5) // Windows XP Pro (32bit), [email protected] Windows 7 Pro, 8.1 Pro, Windows 10 64 bit, 4GB - 16GB RAM
Paper & Pencil

BMus, MM (Musicology)


Posted By : HaraldS - 8/20/2016 7:35 PM
Ron. said...
If all the experienced users who have kept this forum going for so long boycott the new one until basic issues that we have brought up are addressed then maybe, just maybe, someone will pay attention.


Well, your suggestion would instead keep the traffic to this old rusty out-of-date dotNetBB forum...and thus could be interpreted as that we users like to stick to that. As far as I'm concerned, that would be false. Even if the new forums are more a stumble than a step into the right direction, it's still the right direction. Boycotting doesn't make clear what you want, only using makes that clear, IMHO.

Harald


Finale 3.0-2014.5, german edition, Windows 7
lots of hardware synths/keys, Cubase 7 / trombonist, pianist, conductor / Recklinghausen, Germany


Posted By : Ralph L. Bowers Jr. - 8/20/2016 7:40 PM
HaraldS said...
Ron. said...
If all the experienced users who have kept this forum going for so long boycott the new one until basic issues that we have brought up are addressed then maybe, just maybe, someone will pay attention.


Well, your suggestion would instead keep the traffic to this old rusty out-of-date dotNetBB forum...and thus could be interpreted as that we users like to stick to that. As far as I'm concerned, that would be false. Even if the new forums are more a stumble than a step into the right direction, it's still the right direction. Boycotting doesn't make clear what you want, only using makes that clear, IMHO.

Harald


There have been many evolutionary dead ends! This may be one unless there is a great deal of improvement.


Finale 2010b, 2011b, 2012c, 2014d, 2014.5 TGTools Pro, Patterson plugins, JW plugins (current for each Finale Instalation)
Sibelius 6.2, 7.1.3, 7.5.1, 8.4.1, Write Score Sound Sets, TMT Publisher Bundle Plugins, Bob Zawalich plugins, Dolet 6.6
Print Music 2004, 2010a, 2011a, 2014a
Progression, Progression 2, Progression 3, Notion 4, [Notion 5, (bought but not installed)update finally installed]
Pro Tools 9.5, Reaper
Kontakt 5
GPO4, GPO5, World Instruments
SmartScore X Pro, SmartScore X2 Pro, PhotoScore Ultimate 6 & 7 & 8.04 ( 7 has some utility----best of those available, 8 has some issues that need fixing)
M-Audio "Oxygen 25" Midi input keyboard (recent addition 2014)
Systems (5) // Windows XP Pro (32bit), [email protected] Windows 7 Pro, 8.1 Pro, Windows 10 64 bit, 4GB - 16GB RAM
Paper & Pencil

BMus, MM (Musicology)


Posted By : SysExJohn - 8/22/2016 4:23 AM
HaraldS said...
Well, your suggestion would instead keep the traffic to this old rusty out-of-date dotNetBB forum...and thus could be interpreted as that we users like to stick to that. As far as I'm concerned, that would be false. Even if the new forums are more a stumble than a step into the right direction, it's still the right direction. Boycotting doesn't make clear what you want, only using makes that clear, IMHO.

Harald

[rant]
Just because something is old and rusty doesn't necessarily mean that it no longer functions perfectly adequately.
Neither does newness equate with quality.
Wouldn't you agree?

I notice that the 'new', new Garritan forum has more questions regarding its use within Finale than anything else. All unanswered.
The people who (used to) frequent the Northern Sounds forum (where Gary started to talk to users) seem to have decided to ignore it.
The main Garritan web site no longer directs one to the 'old', new Garritan forum.

This all is very reminiscent of the MMA (MIDI Manufacturers Association) decision to expunge its old forum and replace it with a new, all singing and dancing forum.
With the demise of the old forum they threw away many years of useful exchange of information between users and developers.
The marketing concept was to persuade more users to get involved. The result seems to have been the exact opposite.
[/rant]


John Garside.

at MIDI-tutor.proboards.com

Finale 2012c, Sonar 7 PE, XGworks.
Garritan GPO4, JABB, COMB, IO, Organs, Steinway, Harps + GPO5.
E-MU 1616m PCI and Cardbus x 2.
Yamaha AN1x.


Posted By : Zuill - 8/22/2016 6:38 AM
I find the new forum less friendly for me in terms of what it offers. There is so much here that is easier to read and follow. I use what works for me. Let's see what happens. I have missed seeing who's on here, as that is broken. But the new forum doesn't have that feature either.

Zuill


"When all is said and done, more is said than done."
 
Win 7 64bit, 2011b, 2012c, 2014d, 2014.5 
 
Favorite Forum quote: "Please, everybody, IGNORE THE TROLL!"


Posted By : Ron. - 8/22/2016 7:51 AM
Zuill said...
I find the new forum less friendly for me in terms of what it offers. There is so much here that is easier to read and follow. I use what works for me. Let's see what happens. I have missed seeing who's on here, as that is broken. But the new forum doesn't have that feature either.

Zuill


Are you talking about this?


Finale 25

GPO5, JaBB3, GIO, COMB2, GWI, GIFF, Steinway Basic.

Windows 7; 10 GB RAM.

www.composeforums.com


Posted By : Mike Rosen - 8/22/2016 9:02 AM
It seems to be working for me, too.



Mike Rosen
www.specialmillwork.com

Bass with Choir of the Sound www.choirofthesound.org
Volunteer copyist (The Gang of Twelve) for the Barbershop Harmony Society
FINALE TIPS at www.specialmillwork.com/finale-tips-and-tricks/index.html

Finale 2014.5 on El Capitan
Simple Entry, QWERTY keyboard, numberpad. That's my system, and I'm stickin' to it.

"As a musician, he's a damn fine woodworker."


Posted By : Ralph L. Bowers Jr. - 8/22/2016 9:19 AM
Does not work for me. I get Zuill's results, and when you click details it only show's myself and visitor (two total) this is not the correct behavior. It's broken.....(even clearing the browser) at least for me.


Finale 2010b, 2011b, 2012c, 2014d, 2014.5 TGTools Pro, Patterson plugins, JW plugins (current for each Finale Instalation)
Sibelius 6.2, 7.1.3, 7.5.1, 8.4.1, Write Score Sound Sets, TMT Publisher Bundle Plugins, Bob Zawalich plugins, Dolet 6.6
Print Music 2004, 2010a, 2011a, 2014a
Progression, Progression 2, Progression 3, Notion 4, [Notion 5, (bought but not installed)update finally installed]
Pro Tools 9.5, Reaper
Kontakt 5
GPO4, GPO5, World Instruments
SmartScore X Pro, SmartScore X2 Pro, PhotoScore Ultimate 6 & 7 & 8.04 ( 7 has some utility----best of those available, 8 has some issues that need fixing)
M-Audio "Oxygen 25" Midi input keyboard (recent addition 2014)
Systems (5) // Windows XP Pro (32bit), [email protected] Windows 7 Pro, 8.1 Pro, Windows 10 64 bit, 4GB - 16GB RAM
Paper & Pencil

BMus, MM (Musicology)


Posted By : Charles Lawrence - 8/22/2016 10:09 AM
It's still broken.  I used to look at it all the time when it was working, click "Details", and never was there less than a full page of guests and registered users, not jut one or two.  Also, look carefully.  Most of the time you are not registered yourself as online!



"Anything is possible if you don't know what you are talking about!"

Windows 10 Professional (x64) (build 10586)
 
3.50 gigahertz Intel Core i7-5930K, Multi-core (6 total), Hyper-threaded (12 total)
32638 Megabytes Usable Installed Memory, 17514.37 Gigabytes Usable Hard Drive Capacity
NVIDIA GeForce GTX 980 - 4GB [Display adapter]
ASUS Rampage V Extreme motherboard, Realtek HD Audio

Finale 2014.5.6359
Garritan GPO4.02


Cakewalk SONAR X3 - (X3e build 244) - x64, Sound Forge Audio Studio 10.0, Audacity 2.1.0
Sharpeye 2.68, PhotoScore Ultimate 7.0.2, SmartScore X2 Pro 10.5.8

"There is a world of difference between a person who has a big problem and a person who makes a problem big." – John Maxwell

Post Edited (Charles Lawrence) : 8/22/2016 10:25:16 AM (GMT-5)


Posted By : Mike Rosen - 8/22/2016 10:12 AM
I'm still seeing the same thing I saw before. So, I guess it is broken.



Mike Rosen
www.specialmillwork.com

Bass with Choir of the Sound www.choirofthesound.org
Volunteer copyist (The Gang of Twelve) for the Barbershop Harmony Society
FINALE TIPS at www.specialmillwork.com/finale-tips-and-tricks/index.html

Finale 2014.5 on El Capitan
Simple Entry, QWERTY keyboard, numberpad. That's my system, and I'm stickin' to it.

"As a musician, he's a damn fine woodworker."


Posted By : Motet - 8/22/2016 11:45 AM
If you're lucky you may see a name besides yourself. Note the "0 Guest(s)"--that used to be a substantial number.


Finale 2014.5, 2011b, 2005, TGTools
Windows 7, MIDI input
Finale Transposition Chart


Posted By : Zuill - 8/26/2016 12:01 PM
Is the new Help Center in operation? I can't seem to connect.

Zuill

P.S.: I guess it's up again. Its format is hard to follow for me.


"When all is said and done, more is said than done."
 
Win 7 64bit, 2011b, 2012c, 2014d, 2014.5 
 
Favorite Forum quote: "Please, everybody, IGNORE THE TROLL!"

Post Edited (Zuill) : 8/26/2016 12:44:13 PM (GMT-5)


Posted By : bpalm - 8/26/2016 1:20 PM
Ron. said...
If all the experienced users who have kept this forum going for so long boycott the new one until basic issues that we have brought up are addressed then maybe, just maybe, someone will pay attention.


Pretty much what happened with removing the scanning feature because John Mackey and groupthink folks were misinformed and basically boycotted MakeMusic back to the stone age. Well, boycotted by complaining and pouting.
Result? Scanning features gone.

Ron I don't see why your idea wouldn't work. Let's try and boycott this forum change. We know MakeMusic has caved before, they'll cave again. Precedent has been set. Who's with Ron?

If we all pout and boycott enough, we'll get what we want. Mackey style. :)

Posted By : Motet - 9/10/2016 3:24 PM
I posted in the new forum a couple of times at the beginning, but decided it was not for me. Everyone once in a while, now, someone wanders in and posts something (often off-topic) and I get email. I can't figure out how to unsubscribe. If I click the Unsubscribe link in the email, it just leads to the forum. I log in, but don't see where to cancel. Does anyone know?


Finale 2014.5, 2011b, 2005, TGTools
Windows 7, MIDI input
Finale Transposition Chart


Posted By : Daz - 9/10/2016 8:20 PM
Hi Motet

At the top of the screen click on "My activities"
On the "My Activites" screen click on "Following"
From there, you can see which threads you are subscribed to, and unsubscribe.
You will have to do this each time you contribute to a topic.

Cheers...


Daz. :o)

------------------------
Finale 2006-2011, Finale 25 - Win7 64 bit
Core2 Duo i7-4790, 16Gb Ram, Soundblaster Z


Posted By : Motet - 9/10/2016 9:18 PM
Thanks! I don't think I would have figured that out.


Finale 2014.5, 2011b, 2005, TGTools
Windows 7, MIDI input
Finale Transposition Chart


Posted By : Ron. - 9/11/2016 7:50 AM
Yesterday I received an email in response to a question I posted on this new forum when it came into existence--a month ago now?--and, as is often the case in responses of this sort, it did not address my question.

Sorry, MM, but I will not be using this new "improved" forum.


Finale 25

GPO5, JaBB3, GIO, COMB2, GWI, GIFF, Steinway Basic.

Windows 7; 10 GB RAM.

www.composeforums.com


Posted By : Motet - 9/11/2016 12:43 PM
Yeah, it turned out I had four "subscriptions" from weeks ago.

Unfortunately for the poor new people needing help, the Finale website really pushes the new forum, and MM seems to be putting zero effort into it. Is there a still a link to here? Perhaps these forums will be limited from now on to old users. I have to say these forums have been crucial to my mastering such a complex program, the nature of which dictates that those who use it day in and day out are going to be more expert on how to use it than customer support people, who are better focused on operational issues.


Finale 2014.5, 2011b, 2005, TGTools
Windows 7, MIDI input
Finale Transposition Chart


Posted By : gogreen - 9/11/2016 12:56 PM
Somebody said...
Unfortunately for the poor new people needing help, the Finale website really pushes the new forum, and MM seems to be putting zero effort into it. Is there a still a link to here? Perhaps these forums will be limited from now on to old users. I have to say these forums have been crucial to my mastering such a complex program, the nature of which dictates that those who use it day in and day out are going to be more expert on how to use it than customer support people, who are better focused on operational issues.

Here, here, Motet! Well-said. And losing such a resource would be a shame. For MM, that should be unthinkable.


Arthur J. Michaels

/www.facebook.com/composerarthurjmichaels

Finale 2000, 2001, 2003, 2005, 2006, 2007, 2011b.r2, 2014d, 2014.5, Finale 25
Core i7 860 @ 2.80 GHz, 8.0 GB RAM, Windows 10 Home x64
Garritan COMB2, GPO4, GPO5, Aria Player 1.872, Audacity 2.1.2
Dell 2408 WFP, 1920x1200
M-Audio Delta Audiophile 2496
Casio WK-3000
M-Audio AV40 monitors
AKG K-240 Studio headphones
Brother MFC-L2740DW printer


Posted By : Mike Rosen - 9/11/2016 1:13 PM
They want us to come over, so their "customer success" people won't have to answer the questions.

I, for one, will not.



Mike Rosen
www.specialmillwork.com

Bass with Choir of the Sound www.choirofthesound.org
Volunteer copyist (The Gang of Twelve) for the Barbershop Harmony Society
FINALE TIPS at www.specialmillwork.com/finale-tips-and-tricks/index.html

Finale 2014.5 on El Capitan
Simple Entry, QWERTY keyboard, numberpad. That's my system, and I'm stickin' to it.

"As a musician, he's a damn fine woodworker."


Posted By : Ralph L. Bowers Jr. - 9/11/2016 1:40 PM
The glaring deficiencies of the "New Forum" have been pointed out to them (MM) from its launch. If they choose not to act upon that information and bring it to the point where it needs to be.......well that's on them than and they will lose most of the knowledgeable posters on this forum from migrating to that one.


Finale 2010b, 2011b, 2012c, 2014d, 2014.5 TGTools Pro, Patterson plugins, JW plugins (current for each Finale Instalation)
Sibelius 6.2, 7.1.3, 7.5.1, 8.4.2, Write Score Sound Sets, TMT Publisher Bundle Plugins, Bob Zawalich plugins, Dolet 6.6
Print Music 2004, 2010a, 2011a, 2014a
Progression, Progression 2, Progression 3, Notion 4, [Notion 5, (bought but not installed)update finally installed]
Pro Tools 9.5, Reaper
Kontakt 5
GPO4, GPO5, World Instruments
SmartScore X Pro, SmartScore X2 Pro, PhotoScore Ultimate 6 & 7 & 8.04 ( 7 has some utility----best of those available, 8 has some issues that need fixing)
M-Audio "Oxygen 25" Midi input keyboard (recent addition 2014)
Systems (5) // Windows XP Pro (32bit), [email protected] Windows 7 Pro, 8.1 Pro, Windows 10 64 bit, 4GB - 16GB RAM
Paper & Pencil

BMus, MM (Musicology)


Posted By : Motet - 9/11/2016 1:50 PM
Given better forum software I would participate, and tying things to customer-support tickets is not a bad idea at all. But I think the current software is unworkable and beyond saving (I suspect the developer had zero experience in social media), so they would need to bite the bullet and start over. They may have signed a multi-year contract, though.

Off the top of my head, some things it needs:

  • Attachments and inline graphics and URLs
  • Remembering your place in threads you've read
  • A compact list of topics and sub-forums sortable by date of last posting
  • The ability to "forget" a thread
  • No email notification by default (the current method is ridiculous)
  • The ability to edit or remove a posting you have second thoughts about
  • The ability to be anonymous (that is, like here have an alias without publishing your name, but still requiring a consistent login)
  • Search
  • An employee who devotes full time to being a moderator
  • The overall concept of an ongoing resource rather than problems to be dealt with and closed
  • Incorporation of legacy postings from here (I don't think this is at all impossible)


Finale 2014.5, 2011b, 2005, TGTools
Windows 7, MIDI input
Finale Transposition Chart


Posted By : Peter Thomsen - 9/11/2016 2:05 PM
Motet said...
… Is there a still a link to here? Perhaps these forums will be limited from now on to old users …

There is still a link, but it is perhaps not so obvious:



Click the Finale logo to get here.
Click the underlined word forum to get to the new forum.

Peter


Mac Finale, 2012c, 2014d & 2014.5, Dolet 6.6 plug-in, Mac OS X 10.9.5, iMac Intel Core i7, 2.93 GHz, 16 GB RAM


Posted By : N. Grossingink - 9/11/2016 2:06 PM
In Make Music's own words:

Our Customer Success team will be actively participating in our new help center - We hope to create a more transparent view into product development and foster helpful discussion related to the use of our products.

So far that has not happened. Did they think we wouldn't notice?

I participated fairly often in this new group from the start, but am quickly losing interest. The level of discussion is not nearly as high as on this here group. Here, experts and newcomers to Finale can rub elbows, learn the basics and more advanced techniques. Don't fix what's not broken. Just give us a forum exactly like this one only with updated software.

N.


OSX Mavericks 10.9.5
Finale 2011c, 2012c for production work

OSX El Capitan 10.11.6
Finale 2014.5

TgTools, Patterson Plugins, JW Change and Staff Polyphony, QuicKeys 4
Mac Mini 2.4 Ghz Intel, 8GB RAM
New Belgium Fat Tire Ale


Posted By : Motet - 9/11/2016 3:10 PM
If you're at www.finalemusic.com/support and you click the Community link at the left, you indeed get the page Peter shows, but if you click the much more prominent Learn More button under Community in the main part of the page you're taken straight to the new forum.


Finale 2014.5, 2011b, 2005, TGTools
Windows 7, MIDI input
Finale Transposition Chart


Posted By : LP - 11/17/2016 2:22 AM
I have used Google Drive. It actually CHANGED the content of my files - more than twice !!! This is NOT a good idea at all.