The original version of this page can be found at : http://forum.makemusic.com/default.aspx?f=5&m=490593
Posted By : winknotes - 12/22/2016 11:19 AM
So I've had this problem for quite some time where CC1 events affect CC11 values in playback.

So for example the piece I'm working on now I've inserted a CC1 event of 0 so the violin switches from harmonic sustained to normal sustain. That switch works perfectly however CC11 also goes to 0 so it's inaudible. Now in this case I was able to insert a hidden expression to make CC11 value 80 and that worked. But I've never been able to figure out why CC1 changes CC11 values.

Does anyone have any thoughts or similar experience? Maybe I should just open a case?


Steve Winkler

Finale 2009c, 2011b, 2012c
GPO, GPO4, JABB3, VSL SE/SE+
Windows 7 Professional 64-bit


Posted By : Bill Reed - 12/22/2016 12:01 PM
Hi Steve,

Did you have this issue previous to v25? Are you using the VSL HP Preferences or just the dump file? Do you have the VI Pro player? If so look at the controller map tab to see if there's any linkage between the two.

Bill


Finale 25, Sibelius 8.4, Notion 6, Overture 5.1, Cubase 8.5
Win10 x64, 32GB RAM
Focusrite Scarlett 18i20
Kontakt, VSL, VE Pro, EWQL Orch, Choir and Pianos
August Forster 190


Posted By : winknotes - 12/22/2016 2:03 PM
I have had the problem prior to V25 and I'm using HP Preferences along with the dump file. I do not have the Pro player but do have Vienna Ensemble Pro. Good idea though about the controller mapping.


Steve Winkler

Finale 2009c, 2011b, 2012c
GPO, GPO4, JABB3, VSL SE/SE+
Windows 7 Professional 64-bit


Posted By : Bill Reed - 12/22/2016 3:02 PM
It's a shame VSL has never put any effort into working with Finale. The HP preference they supply are, well, pathetic to say the least.

You might try setting up a test HP preference set to see if that works better. You can set the keyswitch as action 1 and CC1 as action 2. Use action 3 to set the dynamics controllers.


Finale 25, Sibelius 8.4, Notion 6, Overture 5.1, Cubase 8.5
Win10 x64, 32GB RAM
Focusrite Scarlett 18i20
Kontakt, VSL, VE Pro, EWQL Orch, Choir and Pianos
August Forster 190


Posted By : nordensten - 12/22/2016 6:05 PM
I've recently terminated 3 or 4 year long campaign trying to convince makemusic that post finale 2012 there are serious trouble with CC1. I've documented it and it has also been confirmed by Vsl. One may circumvent many issues by using a different controller though.


(Finale 1.0 (1988) -> v.25) using 2012c & v.25
Cubase 8.5 Pro & Reaper - Vienna Ensemble Pro - Ircam SPAT - Hauptwerk 4 - (Overture 5) - Dorico
Libraries: VSL, Spitfire, Orchestral Tools, Xsample, Embertone, Wallander, Pianoteq, Sample Modeling, EWQL +++
Garritan Steinway - Garritan CFX pianos
Multiple Windows computers W7/W8.1/i7/32GB


Posted By : Bill Reed - 12/22/2016 6:23 PM
Oy, thought that had been fixed...


Finale 25, Sibelius 8.4, Notion 6, Overture 5.1, Cubase 8.5
Win10 x64, 32GB RAM
Focusrite Scarlett 18i20
Kontakt, VSL, VE Pro, EWQL Orch, Choir and Pianos
August Forster 190


Posted By : winknotes - 12/22/2016 9:30 PM
I guess in my case then I'd need to change CC1 to something else because HP relies on CC11 + velocity as it's method for controlling Volume correct?


Steve Winkler

Finale 2009c, 2011b, 2012c
GPO, GPO4, JABB3, VSL SE/SE+
Windows 7 Professional 64-bit


Posted By : Bill Reed - 12/23/2016 9:02 AM
It looks like the VSL preference are setup to use CC7 + velocity, CC11 would be more topical. I often use CC16 as a controller, as it doesn't conflict with anything else.


Finale 25, Sibelius 8.4, Notion 6, Overture 5.1, Cubase 8.5
Win10 x64, 32GB RAM
Focusrite Scarlett 18i20
Kontakt, VSL, VE Pro, EWQL Orch, Choir and Pianos
August Forster 190


Posted By : winknotes - 12/23/2016 10:14 AM
Maybe that's my problem. Here are my preferences which I'm sure I hadn't changed from the HP file I downloaded from Vienna some years ago.


Steve Winkler

Finale 2009c, 2011b, 2012c
GPO, GPO4, JABB3, VSL SE/SE+
Windows 7 Professional 64-bit


Posted By : nordensten - 12/23/2016 5:51 PM
VSL, by default, uses CC1 to navigate vertically in matrices (matrixes) in VIP.. In certain scenarios CC1 (in Finale post v 2012) will interfere with CC11 (and CC7). Most of those issues can be avoided by replacing CC1 with e.g. CC3. it's a matter of changing a single digit in VIP and in Finale's human playback playing techniques, yet it appears to be rocket science to most people.


(Finale 1.0 (1988) -> v.25) using 2012c & v.25
Cubase 8.5 Pro & Reaper - Vienna Ensemble Pro - Ircam SPAT - Hauptwerk 4 - (Overture 5) - Dorico
Libraries: VSL, Spitfire, Orchestral Tools, Xsample, Embertone, Wallander, Pianoteq, Sample Modeling, EWQL +++
Garritan Steinway - Garritan CFX pianos
Multiple Windows computers W7/W8.1/i7/32GB


Posted By : winknotes - 12/24/2016 11:10 PM
Yeah it's simple to do in VIP/VEP but I wasn't sure which dynamic controller I should be using. Bill's post implied that CC7 + velocity is what I should be using, but according to what you say that won't guarantee flawless results. Plus if I change CC1 I'd need to change the dump file VSL provides which I sometimes use. Not a huge deal I guess.


Steve Winkler

Finale 2009c, 2011b, 2012c
GPO, GPO4, JABB3, VSL SE/SE+
Windows 7 Professional 64-bit